hunyadi

I am hopeing someone can help me who is more proficient on this than I.... what kind of truck did they model off of this? Csepel, ZIS, ZIL, Ural???????? Its driving me crazy! I have found a photo of one on a site which says 'Csepel' but none of the Csepel trucks at the time look like this!!!!

Help - my head hurts!

Its was not included in the book you have - here is the regulation 'rendering' of it from 1953. The one with the oil barrel below it is the 'Excellent Fueler' (gas pump attendant...)

translated wording of the regulation: 10/ Min Ir. 1950 as published on Jan 27th, 1950.

Master Marksman: "must complete the practical exam (shooting) with the grade of 'master' and also must finish the theoretical exam with a grade of 'excellent'. In addition, the individula must posess a minimum of the Iron grade of the Haditorna as well as place between 1st and 5th in a national sporting event. Lastly they had to demonstrate a excpetional knowledge of all infantry weapons in both use and care."

Excellent Marksman: "must complete the practical exam with the grade of 'excellent' and the theoretical exam with the grade of 'excellent' as well. They must also demonstrate knowledge of all infantry weapons in both use and care."

So we are talking about #55 here from our reference book. In Hungarian ?Kiv?l? L?v?sz? and in our English translation ?Distinguished Shooter (rifles)? versus the highest award (#54) which in Hungarian is ?Mesterl?v?sz? and in our English translation ?Master Shooter (enamelled wreath, gilded rifles)?.

Yes #55 is the lower and #54 is the higher. "Master Marksman" had higher requirements in weapon proficiency, plus one had to have the Haditorna badge and placed in a national sporting event. You had to qualify for that particular badge every year. After three years you could keep the badge. If you did not quialfy the second year you could qualify for the Marksman Badge.

Distinguished Light Machineguner

Gordon - 'Sniper' is not a good one for this - having a hard time to truly decipher the meaning - this is the 'Excelent Marksman Badge' as this is not the highest award. The higher grade had a gold finish with a green enameled wreath. To the best of my ability I think that grade is called 'Master Marksman Badge'. Here is a variant of the Excelent / Distinguished Marksman Badge.

my latest addition

Proof positive that this is a case for the Order of the Red Star as the recess is molded to accept the larger points of the star.

What is interesting about this is the construction of the Order of the Red Stars. If you look at the ones posted here and elsewhere in threads - you will see that there are about 4-5 variations of the same order. The differences lie in

1) prismatic underlay on the obvesrse of the red enameled portion of the star. Though you can sometimes see it factored into the manufacture, its is not always so.

2) various reverse details of the star. (The wreaths seem to remain about the same) some have a sharp ridge along the perimeter while others have a softer ridge. Still others seem to be simply concave and have no rim. Still others exist with the heavy ridges of the prismatic effect on the reverse while others are less defined. Some have a 'rivet guard' over the rivet, others do not.

3) perpendicular loop with the horizontal loop for attachign to the ribbon. On many 1st models the perpendicular ring is bent behind the upper arm of the star, while others - particularly the pot 1957 models have the ring protruding above the top of the star. (this leads me to beilve that this particular example is a late 1955-56 make as for all I can see the 1949 HuPR coat of amrs has been there forever.

4) enamel - hot and cold were used. Natrually the hot enamel was used during the 1950's and into the 1960's. Generaly after that many examples can be seen with only cold enamel.

Though I am not lucky enough as Anatoly13 to have a Order of the Red Star with a document - I was able to find this little gem...

On the Kivalo Vasutas: How big is the star, how wide is the wreath and how long and high is the wings?

Erdemes Vasutas: How big is the star, the train, etc...

As all the literature on this (very little) does not have dimension of the badge - can someone post the dimensions of both the badges?

Maybe you know the guy I bought this from. Any chance you know the flea market in the XX district? I have been buying from this guy for years and he is normally trustworthy but I have seen more and more junk over the last couple of years. Guess it's getting harder to come by good stuff these days. Thanks for the info,

Bryan

Quite familiar with the market - also known as Esceri Market. Very nice place to find items, but its also in evry tourist book so they folks like to 'tailor' items for more appeal.

Verdun16 -

It is a nice tunic - but it has been done up by the locals to appeal to the tourists. The medal bar is plausable - but the plastic ribbon bars do not belong. The stars on the shoulder boards are cap badges. They never had stars on the shoulder like that. The badge on the right boket flap is probably also added on. The is a 'Hungarian Freedom Fighters Association' badge - phased out after 1956. Munksor began in 1957. The other badges above the upper right pocket are palusable - so they should remain.

All in all - its not as bad as it seems - I have seen worse when it came to drawing the appeal of the toursists. They seem to think that if they add on enough gee-gaws with red stars - the tourists will buy it...

Verdun16 -

Nice example of an early type - (1950 - 1954) before they went to the plastic ones...did you get some with the cases?

collar device

Close up deatil

As Gordon has found an interest in the factory gurads recently (though I cant find the thread for it!) I managed to find (what I beleive to be) a pair of uniforms to the same indivdiual. This is a late 1970's manufacture M65 style tunic. What is interesting is that the shoulder boards appear to be almost 'Postal' in color - a deep pink color - but they are not exactly the same as the postal shoulder boards. The stars on the bards are reminiscint of the postal/rail type. The tunic is a gray, though not police gray, almost fire department gray. Buttons are Interior Ministry buttons. The interesting factor is the cog wheel with crossed rifle and hammer collar devices.

The ribbon bar is also interesting as it has: Serivce to the Fatehrland in Silver, 25 year, 20 year, 15 year and 10 year military serivce, 10 year defense medal, 15 years police service (silver class), 5 year police serivice (bronze class)

Also there is waer above the ribbon bar where it looks like a medal bar was attached for parade use at several times.

The Factory Gurads were (according to information gathered from several sources) individuals who were in a small para-military organization charged with gurading vital armament factories essential for a possible 'war economy'.

I have found several cap badges and caps - but never the uniform - till today.

HUPR in Gold is beautiful. Is this the equivalent to the Order of Glory in the Soviet Union?

Order of Merit of the HUPR was both a civlilan and a military award. Instituted in October of 1949 the award was meant to cover nearly every aspect as there were 8 grades in total. (specific military award wer not created until 1953) Mostly the award was given to signify great acomplishments in furthering the HUPR. Militarily it was like the Order of the Red Star and in Civlilan terms the Order of Glory. Hope that helps...

Here is what I have found -

Recently on 'Vatera' there was a set to one individual. IN the set were the parade badges and documents for 1950, 1952, and 1954. Each document stated that the badge could be worn from April 4th of 195X to April 3rd of the following year. I have yet to find a document post 1955, but as Gordon pointed out - thre is not much photographic evidence to support that multiple parade badges could be worn. IF they did it like the 1955 badge it could be possible that the 1965 badge could be worn till the 1975 badge etc....

"Piros, Feher, Zold, it a Magyar Fold!" - "red, white, green, this is Hungairan land!" - you got it right Gordon...

Then the 1950 to Spet 1956 badge - interestingly the Xerox book says these are 'extremely rare'. But according to them every student got one??

1949 - 1950 badge

Obscurity is the best description for these times....

1) yes - but there is not photographic evidence that I have yet to uncover except for the plate from osprey

2) as regulations go - they are covering all the bases. The regulations simply state that if the person is a student at Kossuth, but already has the polit leaders or offciers badge - they do not wear the Kossuth Academy arm triangle. So simply - if someone had qualified for being a polit leader / offcier and already had the badge and then went back to scool they did not wear the arm triangle - I could see this happening with a Polit Leader / Offcier who then goes back to the school for a higher degree (because they were churning out officers - peasants - in 2 years!). I need to edit the triangle bit - I said Petofi when I meant Kossuth!!!!

3) according to the Xerox book we got - this badge is the similar to wearing the Kossuth Academy triangle. So its a school badge for the political offciers only... there was two of these typsed of badges - the one with the PPsH and 'Petofi Akademia' on it. This type was used from Jan 1949 to sometime in 1950. Then in 1950 - September 1956 this round badge was implimented.