David Gregory

And cetra2003 is either a previous victim unloading some his nasty fakes or it is another one of his pseudonyms:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...ssPageName=WDVW

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...ssPageName=WDVW

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...ssPageName=WDVW

I've started a thread on an HHOX award document and a request for information on the man who received it at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1207&hl=

Thanks for looking,

David

The thread on Hohenzollern bars has prompted me to post a document for the HHOX.

This is the award document to Leutnant der Reserve Ernst Paczoch of 8. Westpreussisches Infanterie-Regiment No. 175 for the Kreuz der Ritter des K?niglichen Hausordens von Hohenzollern mit Schwertern dated 26 February 1917. According to informed sources, his HHOX was gazetted in the MWB issue of 22 March 1917.

Since the document is too large to fit on my scanner, the roll number 5140 doesn't appear in the scan.

Unfortunately, this is the only a single document and I had no other information from the seller.

I.R. 175 was part of 36. Infanterie-Division and was involved in fighting in the Chaulnes area on or near the Somme against the French more or less continuously from late June 1916 until it withdrew to the Siegfriedstellung shortly after his HHOX was awarded. I assume that he was awarded the HHOX for his involvement in the fighting on the Somme.

Rick (the GOOD one) confirms that Paczoch was commissioned Lt dR 1912/13 in the same regiment. He also believes that for such an early HHOX award, to that junior an infantry officer, he must have had a death-wish.

Deutschlands Heere bis 1918 by Voigt suggests that there is no regimental history and only mentions 13 winners of the Goldenes Milit?r-Verdienst-Kreuz in the regimental awards overview. It also only mentions active officers killed, as listed in the Ehrenrangliste.

Rick and Glenn J confirm that the Leutnant d.R. Paczoch listed in the Ehrenmal was killed on the 18th of October 1916 as a member of R.I.R. 207. His parent prewar regiment is given as I.R. 64 though he certainly was not commissioned in May 1914. As a Leutnant d.R. Paczoch is listed for I.R. 175 it would therefore seem that "my" Paczoch survived the war.

I have never seen another document to a member of I.R. 175, except for a Milit?rpass to a man that served with the regiment before the war. Does any one have any information or possible leads on Paczoch, I.R. 175 or any of the other units in the division, e.g. Infanterie-Regiment 128, Grenadier-Regiment 5, Feld-Artillerie-Regiment 36, Feld-Artillerie-Regiment 72, Pionier-Bataillon 17?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Failing that, please show your HHOX documents and tell us the story of their recipients.

David

This bar is made of 26 mm wide ribbons and nothing glows more than it should.

It looks a bit homemade to me, and an informed source on another forum was not too keen on it. But since it only cost beer money, I am not too bothered about its integrity.

Does the device look OK?

Many thanks for your comments and opinions.

/David

The first bar shown below came from Detlev Niemann some time ago. Unfortunately, I didn't realise it was one of a split pair when I bought it. The "one that got away" also had a Frontk?mpfer ribbon and a blue service award ribbon, if I remember correctly. The ribbons are 16 mm wide.

It could be an army or navy bar, and I am sure Rick (the GOOD one) more or less identified one with a blue backing some time ago.

Minty bars are nice, but these salty ones have really "been there". I wish I only knew where.

And just to make sure that you don't miss what else he always has on offer, his permanent site is at http://www.ordensammler.com/

If nothing else, it is a good showcase of what to avoid.

/David

Reverse of the bar:

The ribbon version mounted with a red cross medal in steel:

The reverse of the pinback cross:

The front of the pinback version:

I don't know where you want to draw the line for this sort of award, but you might also consider adding the 1914/1918 Kriegserinnerungskreuz of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha.

It certainly seems to have been awarded to non-combatants, so it ought to be a match for the other awards mentioned above.

I have started a thread on this rather obscure award at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1201

According to Hessenthal & Schreiber, Duke Carl Eduard had already intended to issue an award commemorating the part played by citizens of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha for their contribution to the war in 1914. He finally instituted the Kriegserinnerungskreuz 1914/1918 in bronze in the summer of 1918 as a commemorative award.

The cross, which was made of copper and had a bronze finish, can be found as a pinback cross and a version suspended from a ribbon. The obverse shows the Duke's crowned initials "C.E.", 1914 and a twig of laurel. The reverse shows a ducal Saxon shield. The cross is very small, measuring only 30 x 30 mm.

Due to the late production date and the prevailing political situation only small numbers were issued as originally wished by the Duke. A few hundred were reported as having been issued in the autumn of 1918.

Nimmergut classified this cross as a military award. Nothing I have read about this award until now suggests that it was for non-combatants, but the only example I have on a bar is mounted with a red cross medal.

Can anyone confirm if this was issued to combatants and non-combatants alike? Can anyone show an award document for this cross or an entry for it in a Kriesgs-Stammrolle, Milit?rpass or Soldbuch?

They look slightly familiar. One of my finds still looks like crap after being given the vinegar concentrate bath for a couple of (smelly) days.

Can I "borrow" your sand blaster one day, or is it non-portable.

Click - der Groschen f?llt!

Thanks Gerd. I tend to focus on combat-related awards and had completely forgotten about the merit cross, which must be fairly scarce.

/David

Did i got that right, in post #18 that is a Hohenzollern Ehrenkreuz with Swords and Crown? Or is it the Merit Cross with Swords and Crown?

Gerd

I have examples of the Hohenzollern Ehrenmedaille in silver and gold, with and without swords, and I am fairly confident I understand the Ehrenkreuz, but what is the difference between the Ehrenkreuz and the Verdienstkreuz?

Can anyone show an example?

Thanks in advance,

David

Ralph,

You always seem to strike a very nice balance of lighting and finish. Is there a secret to cleaning an EK to turn out that nice or did it just come that way?

Cheers,

David

the first picture last ribbon bar, what does the double Schwarzburg-Ribbon signify?

←

Isn't that a double Waldeck?

Lovely bars, guys. I wish my scanner would tolerate three-dimensional objects!

/David

Christophe,

I like the fact that the image shows that not every officer had the time or money to have a "nice" medal bar made, but often simply added single awards to a medal bar combination.

I wonder how many of the bars that are in collections today show only part of what a soldier was awarded.

/David

Blimey. Has anyone else got one?

Hmmm.

The 800 and the other illegible stamp are quite unlike anything I have ever seen on a 1914 cross.

If it were a Knight's Cross, then I would probably just ignore it (because I don't know enough about them, don't have the patience to discuss them and I think they are vastly overrated), but it doesn't look right here, somehow.

Did this cross just happen to have these marks or were they a selling point?

/David

My favourite 1914 EK2 is marked with a simple "G", closely followed by KO's, WILM's, SW's, etc.

It is somewhere on one of these bars and has a lot of friends.

/David

The only Hessen KEZ in iron that I have seen and don't like is the one offered by eBay user raritaetensammlerclub and also offered in his bewildering array of badges and awards, all of which I believe are fakes, at http://www.ordensammler.com/html/940_silber.html

He recently sold one that I believe is a fake, if for no other reason than association with all of his other recast badges and awards, at http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt...item=6521509738

Before the image disappears, here it is for posterity.

/David

The back displays the same cast finish on the wreath as Don and Mike's examples.

Judging by what I paid for it as a badly photographed and incorrectly described "lapel pin" on German eBay (about Euros 17, if I recall correctly), I am confident that it and the ones like it above are all good.

The examples shown by Don and Mike are, like the one below, the most common type of the handful that I have seen.

The front of this "salty" example looks as though a previous owner tried to improve its looks by buffing it with a polishing wheel.

Paul,

Nice little group. Medal bars with hooks on the back turn up on German eBay fairly regularly, and the chances of finding one in that combination without the medals is higher than for many others.

However, your chances of finding the combination as a complete bar are much better.

Add http://sammeln.listings.ebay.de/Deutsches-...ListingItemList to your favourites and keep your eyes peeled.

/David