Blackhorse

Chris,

I borrowed Zipfel's history of KR 5 but to be perfectly honest it gives little if anything on Herr Wilhelmy. Unusually for a regimental history it is indexed and Oberveterin?r Wilhelmy is listed three times - but all in orders of battle. The only additional pieces of information are that at mobilisation he was assigned to the 2nd Squadron and that he apparently was no longer serving with the regiment after it returned to the Western front in early 1917.

Regards

Glenn

Thank you very much for taking the time to locate that information. That's more than what we had previously.

Again, thank you

Chris

Chris,

I find a Leutnant d.R. Schnorrenberg of Sturm-Bat. 5 killed at Verdun on 3.9.16.

Regards

Glenn

It's possible the name may be Schnarrenberg instead of Schnorrenberg. Does this produce any results?

Chris,

the 1914 Army List gives his Oberveterin?r Patent and earlier edtions his Patent as a Veterin?r. The actual date of his commissioning and transfer to KR. 5 can be found in the Milit?r-Wochenblatt as will his promotion to Stabsveterin?r when I eventually work through the unindexed 1917 - thousands of columns!

The career structure of veterinary officers canbe found in various period publications such as "Die Berufswahl in Staatsdienste" published in 1913 or the huge history of the veterinary officials/officers titled "Das Deutsche Heeresveterin?rwesen" published in 1933.

It would appear that he returned to duty as a reserve veterinary officer in WW2. He is not listed among the regulars in 1939.

I will try to get hold of the KR 5 regimental history when I visit the Bundeswehr library in Potsdam this weekend.

Regards

Glenn

Thanks! This is simply marvelous information.

Chris,

veterinary officers did not follow the normal career progession of line officers and consequently Herr Wilhelmy

never held the rank of Fahnenjunker or F?hnrich. Prior to 1 April 1910, veterinarians were classed as military

officials and not as commissioned officers. Although Herr Wilhelmy had a Patent of seniority of 1 November 1909 he

was actually commissioned on the 29th of April 1910 (as indeed were all former active veterinary officials then

serving). As no Offizier-Stammlisten were published for the Garde-K?rassier-Regiment or K?rassier-Regiment Nr. 5

I was unable to determine his actual date of birth or date of entry. He would have served at least six months with a

mounted branch of the service as a private soldier followed by six months instruction at a military smithy prior to

attending the Military Veterinary Academy. Following seven semesters at the academy he would have been appointed as

an Unterveterin?r (Wachtmeister Rank). His first assignment was with the Garde-K?rassier-Regiment in Berlin.

Generally speaking the Unterveterin?r served another six months before first commissioning.

Veterin?r: 29.04.10 (Patent 1.11.09 A) in the Garde-K?rassier-Regiment

Oberveterin?r: 19.11.12 A

23.5.11: Transfered to K?rassier-Regiment Herzog Friedrich Eugen von W?rttemberg (Westpreu?isches) Nr. 5

I would have expected a promotion to Stabsveterin?r sometime in 1917 but cannot find it yet. When I find his promotion date I will come back.

Regards

Glenn

Wow, simply wow. I am amazed. Thank you so much for this information; it answers several questions and fills in quite a few gaps.

What resources did you use, to find this information? I have the 1914 Ranglist and the 1926 Ehrenlist, but neither have the information you were able to graciously locate (at least not to my untrained eye) and provide.

I have an old photograph that seems to indicate that Opa Kurt Wilhelmy served as a private soldier in one of the Hussar Regiments. We believe it was the 10th Hussars, although we're not certain. The family always thought he was a cadet, but you've cleared that up brilliantly.

This is circa 1906 (We believe)

And here he is post war circa 1920

and here circa 1935

We have no idea when he came back on active duty.

Chris,

it can be very much hit and miss, depending on the guy's regiment and the information still available. If he was a commissioned officer there is a fair chance that one of us here can trace his career. One requires army lists, officer "Stammlisten", seniority lists etc. etc.

Regards

Glenn

Glenn,

Here is what I have thus far.

My gradfather was Kurt Wilhelmy. In the 1914 Rangliste he is listed as Ober-Lieutenant and Stabs Veterinaire in the 5th Kurassier Regiment. In the 1926 Ehren-liste he is listed there as well and as aD, but he eventually came back on duty at some point.

What is missing is all the sort of detail you provided above (Fahnenjunker, Promoted to F?hnrich, commissioning date, when came back on duty, etc)

I've been trying to track down the 1930 Ernst Zipfel Regimental History of the 5th Kurassier Regiment but, thus far, no joy on that.

What other Stamm-Listen or resources should I be researching?

Chris

Franz Rudolph JONKHEER de CASEMBROOT was born on 1 November 1883 at Tschetzkowitz in Silesia. He entered Feldartillerie-Regiment von Peucker (1. Schlesisches) Nr. 6 as a Fahnenjunker on 8 November 1906. Promtoed to F?hnrich on 20 July 1907 and commissioned on 18 August 1908.

Rick,

the Oberleutnant seniority was W58w - the 27 being part of the date on the next column.

Regards

Glenn

Hi Glenn,

If I may ask, where were you able to obtain such detailed personal information on the man? I'm doing research on my grandfather and would love to be able to find information similar to what you provided. If you would point me in the right direction for the references, I would greatly appreciate it.

All the best and thanks in advance!

Chris

I agree-- that is his bridegroom's flower stuck in next to his EK.

Page 741 is in the section of retired officers called back up for wartime duty. The units in (unit) there = the unit from which that officer RETIRED, and the unit following, his WW1 assignment. The problem with the Army Honor Rank List is, unless the officer was killed and so his unit was THAT on date of death, what is shown is either

1) his LAST wartime unit (might have retired in 1916... or who knows) OR

2) his unit on 11.11.18. An officer might have served the entire war up to 10 November 1918 in some other unit, but if he was transferred on the last day of the war, he shows THAT assignment. Then for the vast bulk of regimental officers, no actual wartime assignments are shown at all, only whether they survived or not.

Very interesting! Thanks.

The wedding photo is from 1920.

This one is circa 1903-1906 (we believe).

I also have a photo of him when he was in the Wehrmacht circa 1935 (Center rider)

I can't be sure it's absolutely the same person, but how many Ober Veterin?r Wilhelmy's could there have been?

In the 1914 Prussian Rankliste there is a Ob. Veter. Wilhelmy listed in K?rassier-Regiment Herzog Friedrich Eugen von W?rttemberg (Westpreu?isches) Nr.5.

As to his uniform, I believe Veterin?rs wore their own particular uniform, not a regimental uniform.

Mike,

Many thanks for that. What was throwing me was the uniform and how it is nothing like the 5th KR. I'm still waiting for a uniform reference CD I ordered to arrive.

Another item from the Ehren Rangliste of 1926 from the:

Wiederwerwendete Inaktive Offiziere: Rittmeister aD (page 741)

Has Wilhelmy listed as thus:

Wilhelmy (KR8) KR8

I have no idea what this means. A Look at KR8 doesn't have a Wilhelmy listed either in the 1914 or 1926 lists.

What does the KR8 in Parathensis mean?

In the same Ehren Ranglist, Wilhelmy is listed as the Ober Veterinair in KR5 (page 405).

This is, of course, made all the more challenging by the difficult to read German script.

Thanks,

Chris

I think that is merely a wedding bouquet.

What's the postmark on the back of the card? What was your Opas' name?

Ulsterman,

ahh interesting, a wedding bouquet... My grandfather's name was Kurt Wilhelmy. It's from a photo, so no postmark is available.

Thanks!

Chris

This is a close-up detail of my grandfather at his wedding. I was wondering what the award is (at least there appears to be an award) next to his Iron Cross.

My grandfather was an Ober Veterinair. If anyone can identify the regiment from this picture that would be most excellent as well.

Thanks in advance for all the help!

Chris

I agree with George.

Thanks Chris!

Chris

Sure seems like a lot of us Chris' around here...

Is there a listing for a Kurt Wilhelmy?

Thanks in Advance!

Chris