Chris S

As I am on a Pat War frenzy...his is a Type 1 variation 3...as it does not have a pin back and the hanger is different from Variation 1 but the same as variation 2 but without variation 2's pinback.......

Right, now that I have totally confused you............enjoy this great medal...and to think I was miffed when I had to pay 300 dollars for this...I would crawl to the seller to pay this price now!

Chris

The numbers...can't make out one of them in the scan, but they are 200139 and 86736...

Hopefully one day I will be able to add a name.

Chris

The fronts.........

Pat wars closer back

I don't normally bother with groups if they are not supported by documents, as they could be put together...if they are worth it individually maybe...but normally I give it a miss.

This group caught my eye...its just wonderful...2 Patriotic wars 1st class and a loverly Red banner bar.

Nice additional school and Naval vet badges....the paterna is all the same...old and rich...Gerd this will be the first one I will get researched to prove it is a Group...I am sure it is..

Chris

His docs for the medals...here endeth the Group

Chris

His 20 years Victory over Germany and 50 years anniversary of the Red Army

His Lenin Centenary Medal......absolutely Mint...

His 25 year Badge for Valour and Bravery in Patriotic War..

Chris

His Doc for his Victory over Germany Medals....one states Guards Major!

Chris

He has been awarded the Victory over Germany medal twice, one for the military front and the other for the civil front ...

I deduct therefore he was wounded and continued the war as a civilian...both in great condition..

Chris

His Doc which details his award of Class 1 and 2 of the Patriotic War....in great condition as well...as are all his docs...this guy looked after his medals and documents perfectly!

Chris

Pat Wars....just love these great medals...and they have not yet reached crazy prices...unless you find a hanger.....

This group is mounted as is, by the real owner....obviously really proud of his Guards status as he mounts his war time Guards badge next to his pair of Patriotic wars Class 1 and 2.

He was a Major Vjali Robert Alexandrovish

Chris

Well regardless, the first badge under question does not have the same pin back as mentioned for Type 1 badges. Obviously it was (or is trying to be) a Type 2...Unquote

Sorry to be pedantic, but it is a type 1 and not a type 2 (Type 2 were screwbacks in the first place), its conversion does not make it anything else but an altered Type 1 Variation 3.

This conversion is normal as you know , because of the 1943 change in statute for wear, screwbacks with hangers had to be converted. Type 2 were then manufactured without hangers in the screwback mode.

Variation 1 and 2 of type 1 had a pinback, the number range makes it a type 3 of the type 1, this variation was just that, because it did not have a pinback in the first place.

It is a type 1 Variation 3 with an unusual pinback arrangement possible made for wear as a screwback.

The other thing it could be is, a put together piece to deceive, therefore fake and I am wrong!

Cheers

Chris

The pinbacks you are thinking of are not like that in the pictures above. They were like this below .. quite different....unquote

I am saying this...as you look at the picture above, the one on the left is a Variation 3...because it does not have a Pin back.

The one next to it shows the area where the pin back was, but snapped off, Variation 2 of type 1.

As you obviously have PD's book he does state that the pin tended to snap of and why they binned it and made the V3 without it.

As for the pictures above... they are from my collection and not taken from books.

Cheers

Chris

Actually John, it is a T1 V3...I notice now it has five figure number.......it would not have had a stick pin...see attached backs...V2 and V3...V3 no mark were stick pin would have been...........

Chris

Darrell.......slight case of snap........

The back of T1 V2

John

Its a type 1 variation 1...it would have had a loop on top for a hanger...very low number...great piece...it has been converted to screwback...I have never seen one done that way before but very nice...

Yes, some of the enamel has been replaced...boogalooo........no biggie and quite normal.........

Attached a Typ1 Variation 2 ......the only difference V1 and 2 is the size of the hanger (which is lost in history).......notice the loop and the mark on the back were the pin has broken off.

Chris

Paras simply refer to the rest of the army as "crap hats"..........yes, they are very well balanced, having chips on both shoulders.

Chris

there is nothing pretentious about it...the Order of Glory is about the same as the Iron Cross 2nd class...er...and they did win..........the first class far harder to earn than the Knights Cross

Chris

The recipient

The other Doc's....quite lucky to get this quite recently...getting harder to find with docs.......

Chris

Main doc for Red Star, medal for Bravery and Order of Glory

This is a nice tatty Bar as worn on a regular basis I would say by a proud vet.

The 2nd classes' do tend to loose their gold finish over time, but still a glimmer there...

Chris