xxx

The ex DDR states Brandenburg, Sachsen, Sachsen -Anhalt, Thüringen and Meckelenburg-Vorpommern will probably handle this all the same way and so far it would be legal to do it also in the rest of the country. Brandenburg had cast it into a regulation, other have maybe a similar one.

the most important part is this

"Fire brigade awards from the GDR era

During the times of the German Democratic Republic (GDR), various awards were also given specifically to members of the volunteer fire brigade and professional fire brigade. However, since the professional fire brigade of the GDR is not a municipal one, but belonged to the People's Police, it was also possible to award them with People's Police awards. Therefore, it is important to know that not all awards that were given to firefighters between 1949 and 1990 may be worn in uniform. Special medals and decorations with the national emblem of the GDR are no longer worn on the uniform. Listed below are the awards, which continue without hesitation can be worn on the uniform."

in fact it says that every award can be still worn. it says also its important to know that not all awards may be worn in uniform. first the uniform belongs the state so he decided what you wear on it but its only a " may", a word that have some freedom.

then the text becomes illogical because " Special medals and decorations with the national emblem of the GDR are no longer worn on the uniform. "

the national emblem is on all of them! but, the real firefighter awards are allow to wear and otherweise it would be a shame.  the regulations to made a medal bar are the old one, war decorations, long service award, peace time award, foreign award. thank the lord we don't have war decorations so peace time awards, long service award, foreign awards. in this case a firefighter had some service in the DDR so I set the last DDR Service award he got and the current BRD service award in the sense it was made in the 1930s. the real meaning was not to wear two wehrmachts long service awards like here

 this was a misuse of the regulations

even worse when they have the double wehrmacht award and then a third service award from before

the old army

or

police

sometimes they try to get three different  into the bar like here old army, zivil servant, wehrmacht

here is the misuse obviously! the double service award was a favour given by the government to show breaks in service. in the end all former service awards counts for the last wehrmacht service award so there would be no necessity to wear them.

this bars are in the spirit of the double service award regulation

the DDR/BRD firefighter award I made is in this spirit. you can wear the DDR service award, in this case the 10 years but if you had the 20 years you would only wear this and not the 10 years also. and so you wear only the 40 years Brandenburg /BRD service award. btw, like the old bars the 10 DDR count on the 40 years Brandenburg so there would be no necessity but you have the rigth to wear it and so the double service award bar exist. if this firefighter had the DDR Award for merits in fire prevention, here on the typical russian style single bar

I had placed this for the Brandenburg 40 years award because it became a legit BRD/german award. if you compare this with the old bars best example would be the wehrmacht service award together with an austrian service award from soldiers coming from the austrian heer in 1938. you have seen such medal bars before, I don't find a pic just now to illustrate it.

Some years ago I restore some 1864-1871 medal bars in the local church. What I have learned than came into use now for making a prussian medal bar for a firefighter.

The man had the 10 years DDR firefighter service award in 1989 then served for another 30 years in the BRD, to be more precise in the state of Brandenburg and got than the 40 years long service award.

To wear DDR Firefigther awards is permitted but not realy regulated - see her page 52 https://www.lfv-bb.de/s/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Handreichnung-fuer-Auszeichnungen-und-Ehrungen-der-Feuerwehrangehoerigen-im-Land-Brandenburg-V1.0.pdf

in the end there is no basic knowledge how to wear awards on a medall bar.

You see here how the new awards are designed https://www.ebay.de/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313&_nkw=orden+feuerwehr+brandenburg&_sacat=0

a short 20 mm wide ribbon on a safety pin -  in one word - disgusting!

This medal bar is a classic case of two long servise awards showing the break in service because the state changed in between. I found 30 mm wide ribbon for the Brandenburg and 25 mm wide ribbon for the DDR award. Its far from perfect, not even good but I am still learning any time .

just now on ebay

will do it, it looks reasonable aged. what ever he do with the bar it looks like they are together for a long time.

you have probably seen this on ebay, before the pics are lost will safe it here

this is a good question, I have seen the old eagle also on similar dokuments. google find out that the swastika flag became the only national symbol on 15.9. 1935 https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsflaggengesetz

possible that it need also 2 weeks more until this was implementet in an embassy

now I see how it works

a WW 1 memorial in denmark

Just see this on the site of danish auction house, not only the EK" but also the Hindenburgcross the dane from north sleswick got over the german embassy in kopenhagen.

I think this is a special group, maybe interesting for some of you.

[img]https://up.picr.de/43790994jw.jpg[/img]

[img]https://up.picr.de/43790995qh.jpg[/img]

[img]https://up.picr.de/43790996to.jpg[/img]

https://www.lauritz.com/en/auction/1-verdenskrig-effekter-tilhoerende-navngiven-dansker-i-tysk/i6211600/

the WW 1 memorials in north sleswick or south jutland are probably the only one without an iron cross

[img]https://up.picr.de/43791016xi.jpg[/img]

[img]https://up.picr.de/43791018cc.jpg[/img]

wonder what happen with the pics, this program I use post pics everwhere

Gentleman, I see this in a corner in a church in italy lately

anyone can telling me what they are and for what Agostino got them?

so you find his name in this list? thank you very much for your help

no, the ribbons are in the right order it only bleach out in a different way over the century because of daily sunlight. I have remove the bar from the plate and the second ribbon is black - yellow -black-white- black , sorry no pic was made. so number two is without question the ribbon for the prussian-austrian 1864 medal. before knowing this I was believing the first ribbon was for the 1864 medal but this will be changed.

I will look for one of the 1870 EK 2  copy's now around everywhere to make a "Spangenstück" because an original will be to expensive.

gentleman

I don't collector medals but still take a look into this forum from time to time to learn a little bit. there is now a problem which brings me here with a question about the medal bar of an prussian soldier who served in the wars from 1864 to 1871.

only for my pleasure  and at my own expence I restore the bars of the local veterans still hanging in our church. most times easy: Königsgrätz cross, 70/71 medal and Centenar medal. bought the cheap ones on ebay for 10 euro a piece, soft solder an new hook and hang it back to the bar.

Unteroffizier Albert Schmeckebier from the Brandenburgische Pionierbattailion No. 3 is a little problem

pic showing the bar in the first but wrong order as I know now

the ribbons hanging there for over 100 years and only a look behind show me what they realy are

he had 4 medals

1. unknown black-white-black-white-black, measure 30,9 mm

2. ribbon for the 1864 prussian-austrain medal

3. ribbon for the 1866 Königsgrätz cross

4. ribbon for the 1870/71 medal

what could be the first ribbon??? an iron cross 2 .class?

I remember there is a list available with all iron cross winners from 1870. if someone who had this list take a look if this name appear?

or could it be a Militär-Ehrenzeichen 2. class ?

thank you for your help

PK, during Weimar the colors were: Schwarz - Rot - Gold

not allways http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichskriegsflagge

Dutch luitenant-generaal Th. F. J. Muller Massis (1866-1948)

the medal bar of the Dutch luitenant-generaal Th. F. J. Muller Massis is very interesting, this one and the bar of mannerheim are the only with an iron cross and french L?gion d'honneur cross together I have seen till now.

maybe it remeber this battel in 1849 http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http...ficial%26sa%3DG

if so, its most interesting! so called elefantenorden and your man spend some time in WW 1 in africa. mayby a navy guy from the start but settle down as a marineartillerist when he become older.

whats he wearing? this one?

thank you, was thinking it comes from KuK because of the ribbon

see this frackspange bar in the net http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=83859 and wonder what the last medal is, never see this before, anybody can help with indentification.

Hello,I'm afraid that my query about the riot shotgun aspect of this SMLE was a bit misleading,I have taken it down off the wall for the first time in years and reminded myself what marks are on it,and where these marks are.It is a deactivated piece by the way,this, of course,is the only legal way that such things can be openly displayed in the UK.

There is an Indian connection with this weapon,of course,but did this come about much later in it's life?It was bored .410

at Ishapore in 1941 and is stamped to this effect on the left hand side of the buttstock socket,.410 RFI 1941 (can't imagine why I was thinking it was on the barrel band!!!)There is an Indian proof mark stamped on the breech,crown over GRI above two small crossed flags above a small letter P,this,I guess,was done after the rebore.

Chris.

not an expert for lee enfield rifles and british military stamps but if its an original .410 indian musket probaly only a chamber cast will show it . only if its possible with a deactiveted gun ! the chamber will take a necked up 303 case, 56mm long but not a .410 2,5" shotgun cartridge. the shotgun cartridge will not go because its to thick at the mouth. I dont know if india arsenals have marked such riot guns but common sense it that they have something to indicate the change.

again, I know that a lot of old rifles bored smooth in britain as part of deactivation.

Another question, can anyone identify the rifles carried by this group? The German askaris were issued Mauser Jaegerbusche 71 rifles for service in East Africa. I'm no firearms expert but these shown in the photo don't look like Mausers. Possibly their old Egyptian rifles still?

Cheers

Chris

bad picture but looks more like a remington rolling block than a jaegerbuechse 71

Hello All,

I'm a newbie to the forum,and I have been reading with great interest all the previous posts about the SMLE Mk III. I'm hoping

that you chaps will be able to tell me a little about a SMLE that I've had as a companion to a Mauser Gewehr 98 for quite some years.

I'm hoping that Santa will bring me a suitable camera,but in the meantime I'll have to describe it.It is,I think,an all original SMLE Mk III made by the LSA Co in 1911,all the numbers match apart from the bolt which is,I guess, a later replacement with the slab type cocking piece.There are very neatly fitted wooden inserts where the volley sight would have been fitted,and when I first acquired the rifle the magazine cutoff was held in position by a couple of tack welds,since removed,and magazine refitted, the barrel band is stamped RFI 410 1941.

I believe,that numbers of old SMLEs were converted at Ishapore for use as riot shotguns during WW11,and I'm wondering whether many of them have survived.

Chris.

they are, of course, making in india

a chamber cast and sluging the barrel with a lead ball is a must to see if it is the original ( I believe from here) .410 india

some lee enfields are bored smoth to go with british gun law

The recruiting offer to move families as well is news to me and suggests why we now find the purely German ribbons on this lovingly cared for group. Chances are he remained in German East Africa for the rest of his-- or its-- lifetime. Some British soldier may have lifted this in 1914... or perhaps it turned up in a stall some tourist brought home in the 1920s. There wasn't any "back story" on this when it appeared as an anonymous bar almost 30 years ago.

Kibera in Nairobi, Kenya is the second largest slum in Africa, the largest being Soweto in South Africa, and has a population of perhaps one million^{[citation needed]}. The name "Kibera" is derived from kibra, a Nubian word meaning "forest" or "jungle." ^[1]

The slum originated in 1918 as a Nubian soldiers' settlement in a forest outside Nairobi, with plots allotted to soldiers as a reward for service in the First World War and earlier wars ^[2].

The British colonial government of the time allowed the settlement to grow informally, primarily because of the Nubians' status as former servants of the British crown that put the colonial regime in their debt. Furthermore the Nubians, being "Detribalized Natives" had no claim on Land in "Native Reserves".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kibera

last year I read a newspaper article about this, the nubian familys are big land lords there and not like very much, the locals see them as strangers - in 2007 _

Yes, thank you. Have been doing some searching. The period that Wurmbach was on board the Emden, the ship travelled through: "(14. November 1926 bis 14. M?rz 1928): Atlantik, Kapstadt, Cocos-Inseln, Japan, Alaska, Kap Hoorn, Rio de Janeiro, Azoren, Spanien."

"From the period October 1926 ? 29th March 1933 she acted as a training ship, which included five international voyages."

So from this can we determine which peace-time awards he may have received?

Also, can some one post a pic of the ribbon bar Rick Research described?

Thank you,

Paul

as a member of marinebrigade ehrhardt he may have some freikorps decorations

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emden_(1925)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_cruiser_Emden

was a member of marinebrigade ehrhardt

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine-Brigade_Ehrhardt

Wurmbach, Hans-Heinrich Kpt.z.S. 12.05.1891-16.12.1965

10.38 - 10.39 Kdt. Admiral Scheer DKG: 18.12.43 als Komm.Adm.D?nemark

http://www.deutsche-kriegsschiffe.de/Schiffe/panzerschiffe/kommandanten.htm

try to use google

15 years ago I was talking with an old man. he was a young german Leutnant in italy and see the bombing of monte casino with his one eyes in this time.

becoming a american POW he gets some sort of school lessons or brain washing from the camp commander once in the week. the officer, in civil life a lawyer, ask them: who was the greatest german? - thinking about this they say him it was Goethe - the american obviously never heard this name before: how much money have he got in the year? - the POW try to calculate the old thaler in $$$: maybe around 50000 dollar a year.

- the teacher: NO, the greatest german of all times was Max Schmelling, he makes millions in five minutes!!!

that's how capitalism work

Sal, I believe they had a port just east of Venice which was ceded to Italy after the war. I forget the name of the place (Trieste perhaps)????

Don

another main port was pula/pola

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pula