hipnos

For some of us, Miguiel, the answer to your question would depend entirely on what the recipient of that Red Banner did to earn his or her award. Without research, you are buying a pretty piece of locked-up history.

Yes, is always the same thing...I?ve ever think the th SN of the USSR orders are enought to find the recipient name and so on, but it seems that it?s neccesary to kno the name of the recipient...??

So I must admit that a large part of my collection is composed by "pretty piece of locked-up history"...?

Sadly...Miguel

a close up of the back

Miguel

Gentlemen,

I guess, that Igor did a mistake in typing the price tag into the website ?

Well, it's just an ordinary and rather late St. George Cross of the 4th class + that medal, of which 697 items had been issued ...

Maybe USD 25000,- ....

Best regards

Christian

Chir?stian, what do you think about this Red banner ordr 2nd award...at 400 USD?

Regards

Miguel

PS/ A Fake...???

Is cristal clear that you have a fine eye for the detail...

I disagree on the Isabella order, the rays between the cross?s arms are missing...

Miguel

Could have been Kapellemeister anywhere-- at a theater or ...

I?ve thinking about the court for the Orders he displays...

Miguel AGREDA

Is very interesting...

Kapellemeister is...Music Director of the Court???

Miguel

Private Soldier Austrian Bundesheer in the twenties.

Regards

Glenn

Yes I think you has reason. I remember a old Photo of Otto Planetta who killed Chancellor Dolfuss, bearing a similar uniform, I?forgot he is austrian...Fighting for the german Nazis...

Regards

Miguel

It seems german, of the reichwher, I?ve seen some photos in the interwar years...

And what would you think of this one, offered by the same seller?

Excuse me what do you see as the hint to make suspicion fell on this bar???

I?ll be lectured on the matter, please...Or I?ll be a easy prey to thi forgers....

Thanks

Miguel

, What do you think about this bar, It?s a fake???, because

I?ll to consider bought it...

Please alittle help, as soon as possible...

Miguel

And what would you think of this one, offered by the same seller?

Gentlemen: What a shudder I?ve down my spine!!!, I always, save the more obvius faked, are completely thinking that the bars I?ve seeing, at not precisely low prices, are the real yhing...I know is possibly out of the scope of you discussion but, I personally, will be more the grateful if you can send me some ready made hints to, suspect if any of this offering in eBay are or not be considerd fake or...must be treated with considerable precaution.

Thanks before hand, I?m ever more feeling me, after more that 15 years collecting that the more I know is the more i unknow...

Miguel AGREDA

I got this photo recently on eBay.de. It shows an police man from "L?bau (Sa.)", ergo from Saxony. I'd say he wears besides EK I and EK II only royal Saxon awards in a tuxedo style - on his uniform.

The awards are:

Preu?en, Eisernes Kreuz 1914 I. Klasse;

Preu?en, Eisernes Kreuz 1914 II. Klasse;

Sachsen, Friedrich August-Medaille;

Sachsen, Albrechtsorden, Ritterkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern;

Sachsen, Verdienstorden, Ritterkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern;

Sachsen, Silberne Milit?r-St. Heinrichs-Medaille;

Sachsen, Milit?r-St. Heinrichsorden, Ritterkreuz.

I guess this an rather special combination though Saxons are used to wear several more bravery awards than soldiers from other states. I cannot remember ever to have seen a Badener with more than three Baden bravery awards, so five from his own state may be the most to get in one war - and only(?) possible in Saxony. If someone gave me a nice portrait from Baden he might get this one, I actually don't collect Saxony but just had to take it ...

PS: a friend of mine claimed the last decoration rather to be a Romanian crown order, but from the ribbon and the order - it is the first award as it's from right to left - it is a MSH, is'n it? I'm actually sure ...

I?m a rookie in all that matter about the precedence?s system of german orders, but, the "Sachsen, Milit?r-St. Heinrichsorden, Ritterkreuz. ", don?t be first that the Friedrich august medal??? and the other orders...or...not being a Bravery order is in the last post???, the albrech order is nor a superior to FA medal???, too...(Or if this is a "Tuxedo-Frac) group, can be seen in reverse order (but what about the EKII??).

It looks somewhat stange to me...

Another explication is that the last cross is a forign cross like the romanian Crown order, but...the ribbon don?t seems to correspond...??

I?ll look for more lecturing on the respect.

Thanks

Miguel

Each award has to be looked up by its serial number for every single recipient.

Where???

Miguel

reverse, sorry for the 2 posts but i'am unable to put 2 pictures in one posting

haynau

Wow!! A truly Napoleonic Medal...imagine is winned at Aspern- Essling or Wagram?

Congrats

Miguel

Hola Miguel,

No worries about the English - It wasn't your mistake only

When I asked for closer picures of the medallion I was referring to the front with the gilding. Can you post as large an image as possible.

I'll send you my e-mail by pm. If you can send me some high resolution images I'd like to study them closer.

Jim

What part you prefer, All the front circle??. The Spassky tower??. A pity for the maximum sizer of upload (110k)...(some trick??)

Regards

Miguel

Very, Very BAD fake !!!!!!!!!!

Thanks, Quick answer. She looks strange,but I?ve not much experience with this crosses...on the fake?s side.

Miguel

What do you think...

Mguel

As usual it boils down to the the ability of the forum to study and analyse scans .....

.... But nothing can ever beats holding the order in your hands and studying it!! Or at least being close enough to observe it with your own eyes!

.... Till then we can go round in sixes about the sixth digit!!

I am unconvinced as to whether or not a digit was erased. I think the key to this order is the obverse as well as studying the upper arm of the star for its consistency with other arms (thickness).

I doubt that a hand engraved number was removed as this would show without fail! Unless this was engraved shallower than other numbers ... possible but I'd dare say unlikely.

Rotating tool marks that are not as deep as the hand engraved ones are easier to buff out. Yes, that depends on the indidual orders but I have come across some (on other orders) that were extremely light and therefore very easy to polish down.

That phantom 6 is either what is left from a buffed out rotating serial number which remained untouched when the hand engraved numbers were added on later.... or is just a coincidence. What I do not like is that the serial number is not centred but shifted to the left. However that is plausible as well. I also do not like the unfortunate scar (not scare!) on the front of the order - a very possible tool mark. But again, it can be other damage - plausible.

...I may be wrong - but I am not liking what I see! There are too many possibles and although together they may still be plausible, I find myself preferring to play safe than sorry. My humble opinion anyway.

How about larger closer scans of the medallion. Maybe something might give from there....

Jim

?

Dear Jim: I accept any suggerence you made me (sorry for my bad english - scar- scare...). What do you think I must make with images...?

I?m considering send the medal to any of you (better living in Europe!!)

Be a collector, not a dealer, my interest is not the market price, but its truly authentication... (I prefer to change medals for anothers I more sough)

Regards

Miguel

Well I must admit, this one's a bit of a stumper. The wing "spars or struts" - not sure what the proper word is - don't match the FW 44 or the Bristol Bulldog.

I don?t agree on the Wing?s struts but possibly the wheels are different...

Miguel

Here is one another photo what arrived today.

What plane this one would be?

It looks like a English Bulldog...But, If this is german, so we must search in the Fockewulf trainers... like the Focke-Wulf Fw 44 "Stieglitz"

Miguel

Beautiful!! What are these orders awarded for? How many were awarded?

The Nicham Ifthikar is a Tunucian Order, Not very difficult to find whith a wide variety of emissiom (one for each consecutive bey (or Govenor), that display thei name in arabic on the front side of the order, so, they seems the same but they are not...

Is a General "service to the country" order. The other one is a well know finn order "The white rose of finland"

It's difficult to say... one of these three!

There're also other bars that I am very attached, like the first ones I bought over 20 years ago... Sometimes I am very sentimental!

Ciao,

Claudio

I?m wordless...Caro Claudio...Dove trovate questa meraviglia??

Miguel

NICE,

What other trinkets do you possess?

That diplomatic Pair, White rose Order and Officer of Nicham Ifthikar Order, Mohammed el habib bey emission, (1922-1929)

I begin a new topic : please show your favorite order or medal of your collection !

Thanks !

I think that this my prefered one

WW2 group of 9 for Dragoon Officer, Hero of the winter

war battles in Summa.

-Cross of Liberty 3rd class 1941 w/oak leaves

-Cross of Liberty 3rd class 1941

-Cross of Liberty 4th class 1939

-Winter war medal w/ bar SUMMA & swords

-Continuation war medal 1941-1944

-Golden medal of Merit of the Union of Finnish Reserve Officers

-Blue Cross

-Summa Battle cross, numbered as issued

-Dragoon Brigades cross

Dear Marc,

dear Miguel,

there is obviously NO unevenness or or small depression ...

For me, that Glory looks o.k. - look, how deep the numbers are engraved, so there should be almost a sort of hole at the revers, I guess, if the last digt should have been erased .

Marc, you are an expert located right at the "front", please could you tell to us, how the forgers erase deeply engraved numbers (it's much easier with numbers, done by rotating tool instruments) ? Many thanks for your expertise .

Best regards

Christian

Thanks Christian and everibody for your interest and deep knowledge...

Miguel

Hi,

new forum for me...

Would like to get into contact with people who are - as I am - fond of collecting Finnish items.

I have collected so far a big treasure.

I am mostly interested in RUK badges and VR (liberty crosses, class 1 and 2). Also orders of lion with swords or medals bars (with documents) make me HORNY

In the next days, weeks... I will show you some - in my opinion - great items.

Hope to see you at the end of March in Stuttgart, good old Germany at Jani's auction...

And hope to get in touch with you...

Regards,

Mikko

So, You will be very very hot when you see this little bar of me...

regards Miguel