dwmosher

All

I have tried to decipher this name and have reviewed the 14-18 army honor rank list and the 1914 and 1918 navy rank lists where there could be a possible fit, but nothing seems even close. If you have any thoughts on him I would appreciate it. It would appear that he was awarded the EK1 and the Turkish half moon.

Regards and thanks in advance

Dave

Thanks Glen. From what I have able to glean, he had received the Saxe-Ernsteine House Order (knights badge 1st class), by 1914. He received his EK2 at Bertoncourt on 8/30/14, recieved the Albert Order w/ swords on 10/31/14 and was transfered to RIR 243 about that time. He was wounded at Frezenberg on 5/11/15, recieved the EK1 on 5/16/15 and died in a hospital on 7/21/15, at the age of 43. Is there anything else to fill in the gaps? Here is the tunic.

Dave

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Glenn:

Thanks for your reply. I have been having trouble sending pictures to this thread but here is a picture of the label in Zeidler's M1910 officer's LGR 100 waffenrock. Maybe it isn't the same guy, but there is only one Hptmn Zeidler of the LGR 100 in the 1914 Saxon rank lists or the LGR 100 regimental history. Hope you can make sense of it

Dave

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Glenn:

Thanks for your reply. I have been having trouble sending pictures to this thread but here is a picture of the label in Zeidler's M1910 officer's LGR 100 waffenrock. Maybe it isn't the same guy, but there is only one Hptmn Zeidler of the LGR 100 in the 1914 Saxon rank lists or the LGR 100 regimental history. Hope you can make sense of it

Dave

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Wie gehts:

I am looking for information and hopefully a photo of Hptmn d R. Hans Zeidler who received his leutnants patent in 1894 with JR 103, became a captain in 1908 with LGR 100, and died in 1915 while serving with Res JR 243.

Thanks

Dave

Herbert

Your father was an field artillery Unteroffizier wearing the M1907 waffenrock and armed with an artillery "dove head" saber. I don't believe he is wearing an officer's portepee, based on the shape. Field artillery units were considered "mounted" so the sword strap would be in brown leather, not cloth, for other ranks. Also, he is wearing the M1907 shoulder straps which had a feldgrau base, cypher/number in red and piped in the specific army corps. You stated that your father was born in Hamburg, which would have been in the IX A.K. The piping would have been white, which would appear to be on his shoulder straps. Based on this, there are three possibilities for his unit in that army corps; FAR9, FAR45 and FAR60. His Prussian cockade would eliminate FAR60 (Mecklenburg). The closest I.X. A.K garrison town for field artillery is Itzehoe, approximately 50 miles from Hamburg, so, with a leap of faith, there is a strong possibility that your father was in Feldartillerie-Regt. General-Feldmarschall Graf Waldersee (Schleswigsches) Nr. 9.

Hope this is of use to you

Dave

Thank you both for your comments.

Chris:

When I bought the tunic, the boards were missing and the buttons were steel, painted browish-green, so the wearer could have been from either UR12 or UR16. The only thing I had to go from was the placement of the breast awards, the Turkish half moon (which is a screw-back and was on the tunic) and the HHOX on the ribbon. Well, based on a leap of faith that the tunic has not been "altered" in the past 87 years (with the exception of the removal of the boards), and that there was only one HHOX awardee in either UR 12 or UR 16, here is what I have found on that one awardee, Lt. Hans Heinrich Deetjen.

-Hans Deetjen is born in Allenstein (E. Prussia) on 8/19/94

-Recieved his patent as a leutnant to UR 16 on 10/29/14

-Posted to FEA 1 and 2. FFA (Boyen) late 1914 to eary 1915. These units were combined to become FFA 58 on 4/1/15.

-Qualified as an Beobachter (observer) most likely in early 1915.

-FFA 58 sent to Poland/Russia 5/15/15 as part of 8. Armee, most likely in the Baltic area.

-FFA 58 and FAA 284 are combined on 11/29/16 and was transferred from Russia to France on 12/9/16.

-FFA 58/FAA 284 posted to Armee-Abteilung B. on 12/16/17 near Colmar, France

-FFA 58/FAA 284 posted to AA B Fliegergruppe Sud on 4/1/17.

-Mentioned in the Nachrichtenblatt in 6/15/17

-Recieved the HHOX in summer 1917 as an observer w/ FAA 284.

-Schutzstaffel (Schusta) 9 is created on 1/1/17 and I assume the Deetjen is posted to this unit.

-Schusta 9 becomes Schlactstaffel (Schlasta) 9 on 3/27/18 and Lt. Hans Deetjen is named leader of the unit

-Lt. Hans Deetjen is killed in action on 3/28/18 at Pont de la Deule, France.

Now, for the lingering questions: How would Deetjen recieve the Gallipoli star? His service appears to have been in Poland, the Baltic area of Russia, and France. Having said that, neither UR 12 or UR 16 served near Turkey. Also, There are loops for a third award, next to the EK1 and observers badge, possibly a turkish pilot's badge???? ( I have seen an observerer with this badge in a photo before). The other badges and the slip-on aviator boards on the tunic were added, but all fit the loops on the tunic. The schirmmutze for either of these two units is quite scarce. Notice that the white piping was not utilized on the bottom of the cap band. Although I purchased the cap and boards separately, the boards are the proper M-1915 double piping for this unit and have flieger props with no extra holes and the feldgrau on the cap is a dead ringer for the cloth on the ulanka, so who knows...

Interestly, there was an Oblt. Henning v. dem Knesebeck with UR 16 was also posted to FAA 284 and served with Deetjen, but he didn't recieve the HHOX and was killed on 8/22/17. I found a web site, www.buddecke.de that have several pictures of Deetjen in a photo album from Fliegerabteilung Artillerie 284, which may be of interest.

To answer your question about the officer's tschapka, the body is all in leather (including the motar board) and has the national cockade, indicating that the helmet was used post-1897. Although I have seen some metal erzatz motarboards, I have never seen one in wood.

Regards

Dave

Officer's ulanka, tschapka and schirmmutze for Ulanen-Regt. Hennigs von Treffenfeld Nr. 16. The two piping colors (light blue and white) are unique to UR12 and UR16 vs. the single piping color on the remainder of the uhlan regiments.

D

Chris

I'll start you out with this one: Officer's M-1910 ulanka for Ulanen-Regt. Konig Karl (1. Wurttemberg) Nr. 19. Aside from the three Prussian guard ulan regiments, UR 19 was the only other ulan regiment allowed litzen on their feldgrau uniforms.

Regards

Dave

A couple of chevauleger officer caps:

Feldmutze for either 7. or 8. Chevaulegers-Regt.

Schirmmutze for either 3. or 6. Chevaulegers-Regt.

Here's a M-1910 waffenrock for an oberleutnant of 4. Chevaulegers-Rgt.

Regards

Dave

Post 1915 double piping

Charles

The other side for a set of LGR 100 book ends...

Dave

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Ferg1

Here's an item in a friend's collection that may be of interest to you.

Regards

Dave

Interestingly, the buttons on this Bavavarian pilot are Prussian (crown)vs. the proper lion motif.

Dave

Most evident that the group picture are kurassiers are the collar and cuff, which are the same as the rest of the waffenrock (feldgrau). JzP waffenrocks would have dark green collars and cuffs.

Regards

Dave

Igor

From information found on one of Daniel's prior threads, add U-Boat commander and PLM awardee, Gustav Siess = HOH3X 2/27/17.

Regards

Dave

I definately think these are military and the silver top finish on this type of banjo is used on many units (all Saxon infantry, jager, field artillery, foot artillery and pioneer; all Meckelenburg formations; Prussian 1. Garde-Regt. zu Fuss and Garde du Corps; Baden Leib-Gren. Regt Nr. 109; Hessen Leibgarde-Inf. Regt. 115; Oldenburg Dragon-Regt. Nr. 19 and Bavarian Infantrie-Leib Rgt.). Unfortunately, none of these units have no cyphers and a red backing. The Prussian 1. Garde-Regt zu Fuss and Garde du Corps have no cyphers, but the backing is in white and the color thread on the tresse would be in black. Sorry I can't help you more

Dave

Mike

The only Bavarian (presuming the colored thread around the tresse is blue) unit which utilized this style banjo is the Infanterie-Leib-Regt...but with the gilt crown insignia on it. Does it look like anything else had ever been on the silver field above the two rank pips?

Dave

Hello:

Can anyone "kinda" pinpoint when this was used (WW1, between wars,WW2, after)? When I got it the leather sweatband had been tacked in a couple of places with old glue so I took it off. Also, the top of the cap hinges to lie flat.

Thanks

Dave

Very interesting close-up. The chap shown has NCO lace and is actually wearing the enlisted ranks 1900,1902 and 1903 litewka not the war-time bluse. The strap is a light shade (possibly mouse gray) and appears to have a number under a Verkehrstruppen (eisenbahn, telegraphen, luftschiffer and flieger) insignia, so Rick's thought about rear area support troops looks good to me.

Dave

If the horseshoes are in brass and the highlights in the tresse are in black, they could be either for Jager Batl. 1 or Maschinegewehr-Abt. Nr. 1 (both Prussian). If the highlights in the tresse are in blue and the horseshoes are in either silver or brass, there are several possibilities for Bavarian units

What are the colors of the horseshoes and the highlights in the tresse braiding towards the buttonhole? If the horseshoes are silver and the highlights in the tresse braiding is in black (Prussian), they are for a full colonel from Pionier-Batl. Furst Radziwill (Ostpruessisches) Nr. 1.

Dave

Charles:

I can't tell from the picture, but I'm presuming that this is not a technical/artillery/DR22 officer visor and the piping is karmoisinrot; not ponceaurot, and the black cap band is in wool; not velvet. If that is the case, it is a veterinary officer visor.

Regards

Dave

Charles:

Yes, this cap could also be used for UR 14, but for officers of DR 11 and 12, the band color would be more of a maroon shade and the band and piping would be in velvet.

Dave

Charles

Here's the proper schirmmutze for your tunic...

Dave