dwmosher

Thanks Laurence. This is a large scale bust I sculpted and painted of Rommel in 1942.

Mo' litzen. A M-1910 officer's waffenrock for Konigin Augusta Garde-Grenadier Regt. Nr. 4 from another collector.

Collar litzen and boards

Here is a 150mm figure I made using and modifying the excellent Mike Good Richtofen bust of the early 1990s.

Dave

Mark:

I know Marshall Daut, I know the history of the early 1910 Husar Rgt. Nr. 20 officer's attilas and I have seen Brian Sander's Saxon officer's attila up close. However, based on the rossettes, the toggles and the frogging on the back of the skirt and collar, I still believe the tunic on e-bay is a private purchase enlisted attila. As an enlisted attila, you can make it into whatever regiment you like, including any of the three Saxon attilas if you have the right straps for them. Everyone is entitled to his opinions, and even if it is what it has been proported to be, in my mind, the attila would be what a fellow collector would call a "Ricky Ricardo" item...."Lucy, you got a lot of esplainin' to do...", which means you have already lost ground if you want to sell or trade it in the future.

Regards

Dave

Mike:

Aside from the other "issues" with the Mecklenburg general's tunic, you were right-on about the size of the boards, relative the the size of the tunic. Although the boards look legit, they certainly didn't start off on this tunic...

Daniel:

I agree that the attila is a decent piece, but I would not pay top dollar for it based on the incorrect cuff frogging and the incorrect shoulder straps. Just my opinion.

Dave

Daniel:

Very cool pictures!

Dave

Mark:

Although interesting, all have some problems. The Bavarian foot artillery officer's M-1910 waffenrock appears to have had his collar replaced at some time and I can't see any blue flecking in the boards, although it has the proper white piping. If there is, I still could not find a corresponding Bavarian unit for this number (only three Bavarian foot artillery regiments and I couldn't find a either a line or reserve 15th Bavarian foot artillery battallion). The Kleinerrock appears to be legit for GR 3, but condition is a little less than desired with mothing and corroded buttons. For the attila, the seller has added to his description indicating most of the items that are wrong with the tunic. However, this is definateley not an officer's attila, and most certainly not for the Royal Saxon Hus. Regt. Nr. 20. Here is the braiding on a correct one.

Detail of braiding

Lastly, IMO the Mecklenburg genaral's waffenrock is a put-together from an M-1910 simplified tunic. A genaral's pattern tunic should have breast pocket flaps (although I have seen VERY FEW without them in contemporary pictures) and sewing of the collar tab shown is poorly done.

Regards

Dave

'Mo litzen. See-Bataillon M-1910 officer's waffenrock.

Close-up of collar, cuff and and shoulder boards. Note the reichs crown on the buttons.

Tom

Your boards are definately M-1916 Bavarian for the field; not for the Kleinerrock or Friedensrock which would also be piped white but with the bright silver and blue cording. I would think the crown is just a variation. This is a M-1916 Infantrie Leib Regiment board typically used for the Kleinerrock or Friedensrock but was strangely used for a field uniform.

Dave

Here are a couple of rare tunics with litzen. A friend collects imperial machine gun items and here is his other ranks issued M-1901 (left) and M-1910 (right) waffenrocks for Garde-Maschinengewehr-Abtellung Nr. 1.

By a strange twist of fate, I met another Imperial German collector and I met a MoH recipient on the same day. For a vacation several years back, I took my family to Carson City, Nevada, where I had grown up and where my parents lived. I knew there would be some time to kill back home so I had pulled out some early issues of the long defunct publication ?Kaiserzeit? which listed subscriber?s names and the mailing addresses, and I figured I would try to make contact with one collector on the list who had lived in the area.

After a couple of days in Nevada, I looked up the name in the phone book and low and behold, he was still listed. I called and introduced myself and told him of my hobby interests, and he agreed to meet me for lunch the following day in Reno. I had brought my wife along with me, thinking she would like to get out of the house and I promised the visit would be fairly short. We met my new collector friend and had a very pleasant lunch. He then asked if we would like to see his collection. Of course I accepted.

As we pulled up behind his car to follow him, both my wife and I looked at each other incredulously at his license plate, indicating he was a MoH recipient!!

When we arrived at his home, our host showed us around and at this point, I asked him about the license plate. He smiled sheepishly and told us that he had been awarded the medal as a young Marine in WW2. Over the next two hours, he showed us his imperial German pickelhaube and firearms collections, talked about the hobby and the old-time collectors we mutually knew, talked about his family and yes, talked about the MoH.

The gentleman who allowed us into his home and graciously entertained us was Richard Sorenson, who as a Marine private, was awarded the MoH for his heroism during the landing on Kwajalein Atoll on February 1, 1944. During a fierce battle on the first night of the landing, Pvt. Sorenson threw himself onto a Jap hand grenade to save the lives of five of his fellow Marines by taking the brunt of the explosion. Fragments went through his thighs, hips, right arm and right leg. A corpsman was able to tie off a severed artery and covered the numerous wounds to save his life. Over the next nine months, he underwent six surgeries.

After our visit, we corresponded back and forth a few times and he even sent me an autographed lithograph of him wearing the MoH as a young Marine. Sadly, Richard Sorenson died at the age of 80, on October 9, 2004. But I still smile when I think of the incredible day I met him.

Dave

This Garde du Corps parade helmet was one of his favorite pieces of imperial headgear..

and this was Richard Sorenson holding up the interior of the helmet.

A few more tunics with litzen from the archives. Here is a friend's M-1910 flieger Waffenrock...

and a couple of flieger tunics that used to be mine. Heres a M-1915 flieger Friedensuniform...

and a M-1915 flieger Bluse.

Chip:

You have insulted me, my ancestors and my future generations by not implying the boards on the 119th shouldn't be there. Seriously though, any comments or discussions about these items is much appreciated.

Dave

Thanks again fellows, for your remarks and interest.

Dan:

My "branching" into Russian items is pretty limited, at best. I like it, but there is so much "bad stuff" coming out of eastern Europe. I tend to collect officer's field uniforms, which of course, are some of the most faked items.

Peter:

I was able to get my hands on the actual Butterfield auction from 1998, and the the "story" is related in there, along with the items I have shown above (as well as many other family items). I believe Brad had actually been in contact with the daughter who sold the items.

Regards

Dave

Chip:

I would presume that the boards started out on D.R. Nr. 25 tunic, but these were on this tunic when I got it, so until I find a set of red-piped M-1910 boards or a set of muted white-piped M-1915 boards they will suffice.

Dave

Here is another installment of "I love litzen". This is a M-1910 waffenrock for a major of the Prussian First Guard Regiment of Foot that I traded away(including the bar) several years ago. What is really interesting to me is the fact that all of the litzen was made in silver bullion thread and was directly applied to the cuff!!

Close up of the collar litzen

Close up of cuff litzen

M-1910 waffenrock for the Hessen Leib-Infantry Regt. Nr. 115. Note no piping on the Brandenberg cuffs.

M-1910 waffenrock for the Wurttemberg Queen Olga Grenadier Regt Nr. 119. Although the cyphers are correct, the piping should be red.

M-1910 waffenrock for the Baden Leib-Grenadier Regt. Nr. 109

M-1910 waffenrock with several M-1916 friedensrock attributes ( including Swedish cuffs, collar Borte and white-piped boards) for the Bavarian Leib-Infantry Regt.

M-1910 waffenrock for the Saxon Leib-Grenadier Regt. Nr. 100. The tunic is named to Hauptmann d. R. Hans Zeidler who died of wounds in July 1915.

M-1910 waffenrock for Fusilier Regt. von Gerdsdorff Nr. 80 (note the "old Prussian" style litzen)

Here are some pics of the collar/cuff litzen and cyphers from above.

Kaiser Alexander Garde Grenadier Regt. Nr. 1 (This is actually a M-1910 simplified tunic)

Christophe

You were much closer to what I had in mind for the "quiz", but that darn Chip created a second correct answer! I was hinting that except for Fus. Reg. Nr. 80, all the waffenrocks shown were the elite infantry unit for Prussia, Bavaria, Saxony, Wurttemberg, Baden and Hesse. Granted, Prussia might be a stretch with KAGGR Nr. 1 vs. 1st Guard Regiment of Foot.

Chip

I still have your litzen pics and hopefully we can run amok with this thread. I am going to post the tunics so this isn't the cyphered board thread!

Dave

I'm in the process of moving, and my collection is primarly located in several plastic tubs. I check periodically to make sure the moths don't use my cloth for a buffet, and thought I would take some pictures of a few of my tunics. I hope this starts a great thread on litzen (thats your opening Chip!).

Regards

Dave

First are some infantry officer M-1910 waffenrocks. Once you decipher which units are shown here, your quiz is to figure out what is the common denominator to the grouping, aside from the fact that they have litzen and cyphers (hint: one tunic doesn't really belong in the grouping). Good luck!

Christophe

Its a little faded, but here is my Baden or Olderburg officer's feldbinde. As Chip stated, the brocade belt with the red stripe shown here would also be used with your buckle.

Regards

Dave