Ed_Haynes

Yep, just as with you imperial German sorts, we like looking at the backsides . . . back sides . . . !

Maybe the problem is that the BSF are not "police" as you are thinking of the term, Leigh?

Nice pair. Are they both named or just the British medal?

EDIT: Oh, you answered as I was posting.

Nice, but a shame the Egypt has been over-polished. At least not dipped as some dealers do.

For the most part -- and there are always exceptions -- female Indian police officers are a pretty good and professional lot (especially BSF sorts), in many ways a substantial cut above their male counterparts.

To what degree police belong on peacekeeping operations is debatable and to what degree police should pretend at being "military" is another issue, but has little to do with gender or nationality.

Still . . . to get us back on topic . . . I wish SOMEONE would actually look into the archives to answer such questions as these. Honors -- especially to the extent that there is any underlyoing "system" -- are important (and generally ignored) manifestations of the workings of any political and social system. We could learn a lot -- and not just things of interest to Folks Like Us -- from a serious professional examination of the changing role of honors within the Soviet State.

Pure speculation, here... Unfortunately...

But at least it is pure, if it were impure speculation, . . .

This continues to be an interesting thread. This is of value only so long as we never forget that, absent evidence, we are just pitching out wild guesses. It is a shame that a mutual friend who had once considered doing a graduate degree in history now seems to have abandoned that idea; he would have been addressing issues of the evolution of honors in the former USSR, applying his considerable language skills, and using archives to which he already has pretty good access. So, until someone actually does the research and examines the sources, we may have nothing better than our wild yet interesting suppositions.

Interesting data, Bob. Thanks! Pretty much says where the price threshold line lies.

Thanks, Doc. These "extra" documents really add a social and personal dimension to the more familiar groups. Quite a gem you have here!!

Nice one, I think. But the date/number relationship does raise questions.

Good points, Dave, as usual. The issue, of course, is that (intrinsic melted-down value aside) these things are worth only what someone will pay for them on any given day, no more, no less. Every dealer sells their medals eventually, the only question is how long they can afford to hold them in inventory at a price that "the market" feels is too high. If, in contravention of everything in learned in ECON 101, you can hold items for years in inventory and steadily increase the prices against the day when they sell, fair enough. And these things do, apparently, sell, eventually.

A really interesting question and the start of a very valuable thread. Let me look more closely . . . .

The hidden problem, of course, is that these things did tend to get legitimately reribboned and remounted (and I am not talking about what dealers and collectors may have done to them) without the same compulsive attention to types and varieties and sub-sub-variants that we possess. These were, once upon a time, living things, worn in any old way by the people who won them.

Fascinating! Thanks, Leigh!

An interesting question. And, maybe, one I shouldn't speak to, as I unloaded all but family uniforms years ago due to limited storage space. Heck, I can't store my medal collection adequately . . . !!

I see several different situations here:

1- When you get a uniform with the wearer's medals. I suspect this is pretty uncommon. This seems a situiation where you have the ABSOLUTE DUTY to keep them together and intact. Frankly, this is the sort of group on which I usually (and usually very sadly) pass. Getting tons of paper is bad (and happy) enough, but the necessity of keeping uniform and medals together overloads storage/display space. You ethically can't split them up and I'd surely display the medals on the (HIS) uniform, where they belong.

2- When you have a named or reliably attributed uniform (do they exist?) and know what medals the recipient had. But you don't have HIS (her?) medals. I guess I'd pay a visit to the fakes -- sorry "reproductions" -- sections of well known websites, drag out a power tool and slice away the fraudulent serial number, scratch in the word "COPY" in its place, and screw the highish-quality fakes into place. It would be pretty eye-candy but zero legitimate history (beyond a maybe interesting uniform). A uniform without attribution where you can see a Red Star or OPW impression on the right raises a more complex issue, especially if you give in to purient fantasy and start to invent delusional medals for the left chest as well. This starts getting dirty and dishonest.

3- You have a random uniform and don't like it naked and want to doll it up with fantasy medals. I shall ignore the extremely dubious ethics of creating this fantasy item (much stronger words come to mind). I would hope folks wouldn't waste real medals on this misbegotten project (what a sad crying waste), but current prices probably make this impossible (one good thing about high prices?). Whether the manufacture of such dubious history even with copy medals is ethically defensible, I leave to others to discuss. But the usual "Walter Mitty" approach of taking a junior officer's uniform, making it into a shameless Haloween costume with every decoration one can imagine seems to me to be somewhere between flagrantly historically dishonest and downright . . .

About some things (very few), I may be a conservative. Guilty as changed, m'lord.

Just my two kopeks worth . . . .

Very nice. There was a good piece in the JOMSA on these awards. Let me try to find the reference.

Interesting pair, fairly early, and with the original (?) photo intact. Do you have the matching badges or just the documents?

You're going back , unfortunately there isn't a "green-with-envy" smiley

I'll be walking the rounds with you in my head, enjoy lovely Mongolia

Jan

Shall post photos while there, as possible. Though (1) snow has finally come to UB this winter and (2) UB high temperatures these days are in the range of -10? ( C) -- lows -30? ( C). I am insane.

Bye.

Mr. Smartass:

Nesterov was a pawn who became a queen. If you read Christophe's post, you would have learned what important role he played in the Soviet history. He was the first pilot to ram an enemy plane. Following his example, Soviet pilots rammed Nazi planes.

Mr. "Red Treat",

I do not in the slightest appreciate your tone. You are welcvome top like me ort not but you are not welcome to attack me this way.

Please be quiet if you ahve nothing useful to add.

Interesting. Are the medals legitimate, authentic, and original, or are they cosmetic (fraudulent) add-ons unrelated to the tunics??

Indeed Ed, look at the ribbon of the Russian medal... It looks so Soviet!!!

Ch.

Post-Soviet neo-tsarist?

Well done Christophe, but do you get points for identifying a feudal tasrist pawn in a Soviet forum?

Yeah. If real, it pretty much destroys an interesting -- and valuable -- piece, converting it into scrap metal.

A nice display, but the chemical components of most of these 19th century displays would make your skin crawl (and your collection decay).

And this for a SINGLETON, not a GROUP!