Ed_Haynes

Two new additions, interesting mostly for the serial numbers (which, with long screw-posts, may not scan well -- do I need to drag out the camera?), which arelow enough to fall within the "probably awarded" ranges (unlike most of what we see!). When/if research becomes available, . . . .

First, a third award, # 5. This one is cased, and a larger and more solid case than we are used to.

There are usually rolls of Royal Victorian Order awards for various foreign junkets by bored British royals. I have the ones for trips to India. Finding these could help, though they do not give numbers.

I doubt this was a real signature. But they do appear on all patents for orders of knightbood. I have a nice OBE parchment with signatures of "George R" as king-emperor and of "Mary R" as grand master (mistress?), the whole "R" family, less the "little-Rs".

I have some from the government side, but there'll be much less interest in those, I suspect . . . .

These are interesting, and do surface from time to time. There are also letters "from" Queen Mary. While I doubt they personally took the time to write these, they are interesting items from the Great War.

i 'am always very scecptical with medals from asia because they woukld fake even their grandmas if they would sell. Can somebody please have a look at the medal and tell me his opinions.

That is a troubling comment to which I take offense. If there is faking in play here, it is clearly done by EUROPEANS, not Asians.

I have several opinions, but only a few on the medal.

Yes, we are well reminded that we need to talk about:

Slicing Iraq from the Ottoman Empire and the Iraqi Resistance (Gulf War 0?), 1919 (or earlier)-58

Iran vs. Iraq (Gulf War I), 1980-88

U.S. and allies vs. Iraq (Gulf War II), 1990-91

U.S. and allies vs. Iraq (Gulf War III), 2003-????

Do we need to put up separate postings on each and not confuse them?

. . . when are you going to share all the goodies you've picked up on your travels - whether awards or simply more information!

Some has been shared, some will soon be shared, some may take longer to share.

I will say that the forum seems to have gone quiet, with many previously regular contributors gone away. Off on late summer holidays, or . . . ??

Not interested in making this a monologue . . . .

Just to add a few to Bob's list (though his use of non-standard translations of names makes this an uncertain process):

Sukhbaatar

684 - 15 October 1969

Red Banner of Labor

1423 - 24 December 1959

Combat Valor

1552 - 29 September 1964

Polar Star

822 - 23 September 1946

6335 - 24 May 1950

11340 - 18 May 1965

Medal of Combat

4312 - 8 July 1947

19346 - 24 September 1984

Medal of Labor

10328 - 30 August 1956

Friendship

1761 - 12 November 1968

Virgin Lands

1300 - 24 October 1979

See: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3038

Sorry Ed, who is Spock?

Star Trek. Original series. I am sure THIS has made it into every world language by now?

As Spock would say: FASCINATING!!

Thanks, all.

Bravo, Rick. When we do such research, we stand on the shoulders of those researchers who came before and bridge from the past to the future in the task restoring the lives and histories of those who were and are the owners of these shiny things of which we are mere custodians.

Very nice indeed. Many thanks! It is good to see Japanese awards treated as Japanese awards and not as some sideshow of "Axis". More, please!!

I think that crown is to bombastic. "Less is more" I would think. I went to Copenhagen a few weeks ago, but I didn't visited the castle. I visited the artilely and uniforms museum Tojhusgade. Also a nice one withe a few viterines with more modern decorations and orders and lots and lots of weapons.

But I have to warn you guys, don't hurt you over there, becouse the guards don't know first aid and the first aid box is for the show: the desinfectant/cleaning tissues where absolutly dried up! As a result of that I got a nasty infection and couldn't work for a week

afteral I kept good memories about Copenhagen and I'll go back in the future.

I like this Ironcross of 1830. It has a design I've never seen before.

I had put up some images of the Royal Arsenal Museum (T?jhusmuseet) from my last trip to Copenhagen over at:

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=7393&st=7

Isn't there a book that lists all the Suvorov order recipients ?

That's what I thought. In Russian. This is why I posted this here and in our Soviet forum too. The silence over there is deafening.

I don't like it, not one bit. And a fairly crude fake!

Thanks for posting!

Thanks, Jan. I hadn't bothered with the unnumbered/untraceable medals, in any case there'd be no end to that. I also hadn't gone into the lower level "herors" (how odd it feels to write that). Had I done that, I could also add the vodka-drinking truck-driving unnamed hero on p. 28, with his Lenin.

I probably should have included Lkhagvasuren's ORS and have edited the list above accordingly.

My (unfulfilled) hope was to add some enlightenment on the high-end Soviet orders (Suvorov, Kutuzov), but the silence has been deafening. Thanks for the help, Jan!

I recall somebody on either this forum or soviet-awards.com had a Soviet hero star awarded to a Mongolian in his possession.

I suspect that was the sole Mongolian "guest cosmonaut" and I doubt it is in anyone's possession (except his). Information, please, Bob??

Strangely, for such a good friend, Choibalasan never got a HSU. Maybe he just died too early? And, for all the doo-dads he made up to give Brezhnev, Tsedenbal never got one either. How's THAT for gratitude?!

An interesting, though unremarkable medal, with a MOST REMARKABLE maze of devices for the ribbon. Thanks for the post! Expansion, please . . . ???

Hmm... so even here there is an inconsistency between Buyers nine-pointed star (1. class) and Morton & Eden's ten-pointed star...

However, if Jeff's source is sure about the ribbon descriptions, then that's the best lead I've had so far...

/Mike

Agreed, agreed. I just wish we knew more with some basis in serious research in primary sources!!! Usually, auction houses are poor sources for things outside their focus (and often not so good even there).

Jeff,

Is this Order of Science similar to the one I had doubts about in posting #7 (Nishan-i-Ilmi)?

I have only seen that one with a ten-pointed star.

/Mike

Yes, and that is why I'd rejected the Nishan-i-Ilmi -- but, who knows.

See: http://www.4dw.net/royalark/Persia/Orders/ilmi.htm

Yet, at least from what Buyers has, it doesn't feel 100% right.

1st class - 9 points

2nd and 3rd class - six-armed "cross"

4th class - medal

He describes the 1st class:

. . . a nine-pointed star in silver with plain rays grouped in threes. In the centre, a round disk bearing the image of a "civil" lion facing left and reclining on a desert ground. The background illuminated by a sun in splendour rising above the horizon beyond, all fully enamelled in natural colours. The disk surroumded by a wide enamelled band with raised edges. The uppermost arm of the star attached to a suspension loop for the ribbon. The width is 5.8 cm.

Hello

Many thanks to all for the information. Yes, the medal card is my grandfathers, but it doesn't list the MSM on it. At least I know now what it is he got and the sort of reasons behind the award.

Again many thanks to all.

If he got it in 1919, I'd be surprised to see it on the MIC card.

And, while I have NO CLUE how the RAF did such things, the unit war diaries sometimes include MSM or even MiD recommendations (at least for the Indian Army). More to seek at the PRO!

MiDs were used for good service, but the Military Medal (unlike the U.S. Bronze Star) was for gallantry in the field only.

While your point is well taken, Michael, I'd submit that, in WWI, the MiD (like the DSO) was far more ambiguous than it sounds (or, perhaps, should have been). Maybe the US's Bronze Star (or, to make a reference meaninfgul only to us two) India's Sena Medal are useful comparisons to the WWI immediate MSM and, later, to the BEM.

A good example, during WWI (especially), the MSM (for all services) existed right on that line between low-level gallantry and general good-boy-dom. You wonder why a MM or MiD wouldn't do it? It says something that these immediate MSMs were phased out when the BEM came to fill that same ambiguous niche.