Ed_Haynes

Ed,

There are two variations? Can you please illustrate?

Paul

Think they are shown here, the "badge" mirror-backed and the "order" flat backed. There is also a higher quality sub-variety of type 1 but that is probably just manufacturing variability.

That establishes the upper limit there should be (but don't seem to be) price differences between the two varieties and do be aware that fakes abound in these dark days, some pretty good if you've never seen the real thing.

Thanks for these.

There seems to be no end of these, any maybe just recording what exists is the best we can do at this stage.

Nice one. Looks like the official strike, but these are not made by the mint but, rather, by several private manufacturers. Some day, it may be poissible to sort out who made what. So far as I know only medals to officers are named (like the OP Vijay star and medal) and this is very sad. But with regiments naming their own medals (in all degrees of quality and in multiple languages) who knows what will surface.

Still seeking both a named specimen and a group with this, but most of the recipients are still in service. Soon . . . .

Having been in India at the time of this deployment (and a very tense time it was!) and having talked with the folks who designed this one (and the OP Vijay star and m3edal) I think it is fair to say that the desiign process (to say nothing of the deployment) was a very political undertaking, carried out (the medal design, that is) by a clueless crowd who, however well-interntioned, were absolutely ignorant of India's phaleristic history and conventions. At best, this should have been a clasp to the Special Duty Medal, but . . . :bamnger: .

Yes, would estimate 500K more or less total awards.

Many were cranked out by enterprising military tailors and the "variability" would make a strong person weep. Also, the unbalanced ribbon leads to chaos (to put it delicately) in the way ribbon bars and, I presume, medal mountings have been executed.

Sorry, don't know current price. I got a VERY good deal on mine out of UB and, despite efforts, the document did not surface .

Four figures?

Don't worry, Ed, you still are in the 21st century!

Oops. But I don't feel that way.

I = It, of course.

OK. Here it is. Whatever it is. Hardly a "fake", as it would fool no one. I know this may reopen the question of wearing copies (which I still do not think existed).

Sepoy is a corruption of the Persian "sipahi", also used by the French "Spahis".

Linguistically true, but largely irrelevant. I was used widely for Indian-influenced armies in the Indian Ocean basin from the 19th-20th centuries.

And I look forward to posting the story behind it...

Dave

Never having gotten the full tale myself, I look forward to it.

If I post the "item", will that coax you out, Dave????

And I look forward to posting the story behind it...

Dave

Never having goptten the full tale myself, I look forward to it.

Although I have seen "Private" on some medals to Madras units, pre-1903.

Yes, that was used in both Madras and Bombay Presidencies prior to unification, for some units. Very chaotic. India. Love it.

I thought "Sepoy" was a rank term applied to Hindu/non-Muslim soldiers?

No all 'Indian Army' types, even Parsis, Sikhs, Jews or even Christians. Just 'Private'.

Could be, could be. Not sure I buy the theory. Thinking more in terms of "Hadramawt G___ Arab".

Because after 1871 EVERYONE copied their goofy helments on those used by those prominent in the headlines (including the UK, USA, etc. . . . all but France, I guess). The same reason all armies look like the USA today?

Interesting (?) recycling of Tsarist ribbons.

Capture of Paris 1814 (shown thus) / Russo-Turkish War 1877-78 (reversed)

Interior. unawarded.

Document, outside.

Shown above

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=30742&st=4

with what is apparently the wrong ribbon. Here shown in full.

See Antonio's site:

http://www.coleccionesmilitares.com/medall.../campafrica.htm

I have used Elmers White glue on a couple of cases. Works good as it dries invisible and excess wipes off with a warm damp rag.

Same here, probably the safest and best on all levels, at least for the balsa cases. The enameled cases may be gone. But, at least the medals survived.

Yes, an underappreciated medal and part of the sordid tale of north Africa.

I think I'll invest in a new piece of glass.

Well, then it seems to be the original glass. You want to lose that??

These changed frequently. Ashok Nath will have his multi-volume book on Indian Cavalry out soon, and I know he has much information on Infantry (but that would be 3 or 4 volumes, so . . .).

Thanks for the confidence, but Owain tried this on another forum and I came up empty there (too). Gordon, unfortunately, is so focused on UK units as to be of limited reliability for non-European units and the more exotic you get (like this), the less valuable it becomes.

Thanks Christophe!