paja

One more dagger, same as the one in post #107 http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/31679-serbia-original-chetnik-items/?p=608208

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SERBIA-CHETNIKS-KNIFE-WWII-/121525895944?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c4b820308&autorefresh=true

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-48837600-1419632324.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-36868000-1419632334.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-80158200-1419632339.jpg

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-15637500-1419632345.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-97738100-1419632353.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-23637600-1419632364.jpg

I just saw an ad for this:

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-48505400-1419631802.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-90605900-1419631785.jpg

According to description this should be collar badge of members of SDK, what do you think?

For the Serbian "Ljotic" Saint George badge, there are two variations.

One is with Pin and catch and numbers location on the left middle side ( like with the badges on the photos from the previous page) and the other variation is with Nuts, two of them, Up and down of the badge.

Now about the numbering, seems the series made with pin and catch was larger in number and they have indeed zero in front, I have seen original with 0******

The ones with nuts attaching device, are with low numbers ( three mostly ) and no zero in front and you can find them on the right side of the upper Nut.

The two badges that Paja brought pictures are indeed copies, the numbers are similar like those, but they didn't do so good job

( The original pieces have "jumby" numbers- by that I mean not always in a straight line - and these numbers are not the same visually as the original ones).

I am sorry that I do not have pictures to provide, I do not posses a Ljotic Saint George badge.....

To be honest I haven't had a chance to see variant with two nuts.

About the numbering I saw badge with number 01XX with pin and catch on the back side. Also one numbered 17XX in bad shape with same type of pin as on those fake badges and that's about it. Both had numbers in "northeastern" part of the reverse.

Second one with fake 950 hallmark.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-37716200-1419527556.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-97115900-1419527561.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-37259300-1419527566.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-99359500-1419527570.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-02665000-1419527575.jpg

Two more from the same source.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-57141900-1419527381.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-13587800-1419527386.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-35092100-1419527391.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-61557400-1419527395.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-70367800-1419527399.jpg

Comparison or Roman numerals, first one is from that piece I find suspicious, others from previous three.

It's obviously different...

And one more, photo found in an ad couple of month ago.

Same story with this one: http://sammler.ru/index.php?act=gallery&CODE=picture&id=2959

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-39444300-1419526754.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-98122400-1419526755.jpg

Now the conversion variant of that type.

I think this one was sold by certain Croatian auction house not that long ago.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-63433200-1419526611.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-25999200-1419526613.jpg

-Numbered.

-Roman numeral.

-One big rivet.

-No hallmarks.

One more example like that can be seen here: http://sammler.ru/index.php?act=gallery&CODE=picture&id=2006

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-39502400-1419526066.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-68459800-1419526067.jpg

-Again hallmarks, cheap look, two small rivets and no Roman numeral.

To illustrate:

-Here's one "regular" variant of that type, in my opinion not very good-looking, looks painted but according to some sources should be original regardless of that.

-Photos found here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yugoslavia-Merit-of-the-people-1st-class-order-With-document-/331094755872?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d16c90a20

-As we can see it was awarded in 1984.

-Three hallmarks.

-No Roman numeral.

-Two small rivets (or whatever they are) on the back side.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-20523200-1419525241.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-40626700-1419525243.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-56955900-1419525247.jpg

When it comes to this type of first class order (double horizontal needle) I've seen conversion variants - those were always numbered and with slightly different Roman numeral, and I've seen "regular" types. The one from the photos above should be that regular type, but so far all of those I've seen were hallmarked and without Roman numeral! Some of them really looked terrible, that is the last type awarded until the breakup, but all of them had hallmarks!

Source: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yugoslavia-Order-of-the-National-Merit-with-Golden-Star-I-class-boxed-/141516315523?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20f3079b83

The rest of the photos.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-71780900-1419524343.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-20808400-1419524351.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-97481400-1419524355.jpg

One more doctored lower class of Order of merits towards people?

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-21007300-1419524135.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-63127000-1419524140.jpg

How about that placement of number? Was it always on let's say "northeastern" part of the back side or not? I feel that I wasn't very clear about the zero thing, on 4 figure numbers there was no zero in front of it (example 1000 not 01000) on 3 figure numbers there was (example 0100 not 100). What I haven't seen before was 4 figure numbers with zero first like on this particular example (04608 or 04609 not sure) but then again all other numbers I saw before were much smaller...

So Ознаке ЈВуО is so far the best, thanks.

What do the two of you think about the badge in post #153 http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/31679-serbia-original-chetnik-items/page-8#entry609070

Photo of PII variant of Ravna Gora badge found on pogledi.rs (from the collection of the author mentioned above).

What I wish to advice you and focus in, is to have good literature, books knowdays do miracles and learn a lot from them, reference books are not so expensive, ONE expensive badge to buy and found out that is a copy, is enough spending,instead to have the reference material to study.

I completely forgot to ask you which books do you recommend? The only one I know that deals with this matter specifically is "Badges of the Yugoslav Army in the Homeland" by Branko Jevtić (Ознаке Југословенске војске у отаџбини - Бранко Јевтић).

As you said it's really not expensive but from what I've read about it it's unfortunately far from perfect reference material.

What do you think about this one?

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-14872000-1419515301.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-30594700-1419515315.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-27070300-1419515325.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-42525600-1419515335.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-17617400-1419515340.jpg

Seller's description:

"WWII-SERBIA: Memorial nail for the dedication of the Chetnik flag in 1941.

Merry Christmas to all members who celebrate it today

Thanks for sharing What's the biggest number you saw on these badges?

Do somebody knows from which units these badges are ?

The right is SDS "Srpska Drzavna Straza" Serbian State Guard the left is SGS "Srpska Granicna Straza" Serbian border guard. In the middle it´s a chetnik higher officer breastbadge.

Actually if you take a look they both (left and the right one) seem to be badges of SDS

Regarding those badges this might be helpful, unfortunately I haven't got a clue from which book are they, photo found on some forum.

Translation:

Official badges of the Serbian State Guard (Српска Државна Стража СДС - SDS) 1942-1944

1. Badge for lower ranks of SDS

2. Official badge of officers of SDS

3. Official badge of soldiers of Serbian Boarder Guard (Српска Гранична Стража СГС - SGS)

4. Official badge of members of Serbian State Security (Српска Државна Безбедност СДБ - SDB)

5. Official badge of officers of SGS

See this:

Besides inscription on the rifle "Freedom or Death corporal Dušan (?) Ž. Petković" if I see well there's inscription Bomb (Бомба) on his hand grenade

Yes you are right the main dagger fakes are from Leskovac in Serbia. One more thing about the St. George Ljotic breast badges. Yes there are popping up fakes also and hard recognizing them from the originals. The main thing is that many fakes got the same number on the back. Because they have probably made the mould from an original. Don't have the exact numbers that is fake.

I went through some photos and stumbled upon these two.Same badge "before and after" photo or two examples with same number? Take a look at the details of the cross, same flaws..

I've seen just couple of these badges and others with lower numbers had the numbers stamped on different part of the badge and they were without zero on the first place.

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-21935300-1419453985.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-7937-0-90581300-1419453981.jpg

PS I apologize for using photos of items that are not mine, but some of these are really hard to get and not that cheap, I hope no one will mind...

Wood walking stick that belonged to vojvoda Milija Majstorović.