Battle at Les 8 Maisons - captured portugese car

[Robert Noss]

I hope my lack of knowledge about the 1st WW is not too annoying to You.

I got a group of photos from some heavy battles at the town "Les 8 Maisons".

On one photo there is a captured portugese car and maybe a portugese soldier too ?

Let's have the photo first:

Detail:

Writing on the back:

Now what I didn't know before - were the portugese fighting against germany on the french side ???

More photos...

[Robert Noss]

some more photos from this group

I think these photos were taken shortly after the battles

How about some more information about the role of Portugal in WW 1

Kind regards

Robert

[Kev in Deva]

How about some more information about the role of Portugal in WW 1

Kind regards

Robert

Hallo Robert,

the Portugese were involved in WW1 on the Allied side, even issued a Victory Medal along the lines of the British one, the standing soldier is a Portugese wearing the Portuguese ribbed helmet.

I attach some info here under: With regards the Lys plain area.

SPRING OFFENSIVE: APRIL 1918.

" This year, (1918) however, there was a difference, of which arguably insufficient notice was taken. 'Against all precedent, the ground of the Lys plain began to dry in February and March.'

There was enough anxiety for it to be thought advisable to remove from the front, or at least reduce the area held by, the weakest link in the chain of defence: the 2nd Portuguese Division in the vicinity of Laventie.

Least committed to the Allies, sent to fight in a war in which they had little or no interest, less fully trained and slow to acquire Western Front expertise, the so-called "Pork and Beans" were seen as highly vunerable in the event of an attack.

They were seen in precisely the same light by Ludendorff. He would later write that, one "Georgette" had been decided on, 'the sooner it could take place the more likely it was to surprise the Portuguese in the plain of Lys.'

When the attack was launched, its timing was even better than Ludendorff could have hoped in that it caught the Portuguese in the act of being relieved. They broke and fled in confussion. Something of the shock of the German onslaught can be sensed in the diary account of a British Liaison Officer, attached to the Portuguese, Captain R.G.C. Dartford; his account, of which the following are brief extracts, also suggests that amongst those who did not retreat, including some of the attached British, there were many casualties:

9 April, Tuesday;

Woke at 4.10 a.m. very heavy shelling. Guessed from the start it meant an attack. Phoned to Brigade - every communication cut already. Next 3 hours we could do nothing, but nearly got aphyxiated by the lack of oxygen owing to having to keep gas blankets down. Heavy fog on and everybody seemed isolated from others.

I think the Boche must have taken our frontline about 8.30 and the B line 8.45 and was up to Battalion H.Q. by 9.15 or so. One message from X. de Costa (CO 29th Batt.) said he no longer had any command and that it was a question of individuals fighting out. He was killed we learnt after. So was Captain Montenegro, OC 20th Batt. (right flank) and nothing is known of Montalvao (left flank) and Woodrow and Sgt. Ransdale. .........

The Division seriously destabilized by the Portuuese failure was the 40th, which had the 119th and 121st Brigades in the front line. The commander of the 119th Brigade, Brigader-General F.P. Crozier, a senior officer of Irish extraction and doughty reputation, has left a terse but vivid description of the state of affairs on the eve of the German attack, and of the opening of the attack itself:

On the night of the 7th - 8th April we arrive in the line south of Armentieres. On the right are the Portuguese. I don't like the feel of things - all is to quite. I go down to the Portuguese front with a colonel. We walk seven hundred yards and scarely see a sentry. We examine rifles and ammunition lying about. All are rusty and useless. 'Where are the men?' I ask my companion. A snore gives me the answer. Practically all the front line sleeps heavily and bootless in cubby holes covered with waterproof sheets, while their equipment hangs carelessly about. . . . .

'Our communication trenches are fearfully bad,' says the colonel, 'stretchers can't move with ease in them!' 'I know,' I say, 'I'll see what can be done about them, but from what I can see,' I reply, 'I think we'll be shot out of this at dawn, via the rear!' I go back to my headquarters in a farm, and report what I have seen. 'They're always like that,' says a member of the British Mission attached to the Portuguese, on the telephone. 'They shouldn't be there,' I say, 'that's the crime.'

In the early morning a deafening bombbardment wakes me up. Before long my batman Starret arrives. 'Put this on', he orders, holding out my gas respirator, 'and get dressed at once. You'll be wanted. I'll pack the kit. Get you to the telephone place, it's strong.' I obey! All is mystery and gas. The Portuguese bolt and leave the way open to the Germans. .........

From a letter writen by Captain Graham to his wife some days later described in vivid detail what turned out to be far from a routine mission. . . . . his letter conveys strikingly the chaotic conditions behind the lines in the immediate aftermath of this massive German attack:

On the 9th of April we were peacefully asleep at 4 a.m. at a little place called Croix-du-Bac, near Armentieres and close to Sailly and Bac-St-Maur and Steenwerk, when an intense bombardment began on our right. General John at once sent me post haste in an open motor to visit the Goose (i.e. the Portuguese), who were on our right flank, and from whom no telephone message could be obtained, to find out what was up.

I started gaily out at 4.45 a.m., but when I reached the outskirts of the village (or town) of Estaires I found it being very heavily shelled. We managed to get through it somehow, though it was most unpleasent - a shell hit one house just as we were passing it, and it came down with a crash into the streets, scratching a lot of paint off the car and frightening the driver and myself quite a lot.

With a sigh of relief we reached open country beyond, but at the next village (La Gorgue) we found the Hun was gassing it as well as shelling it, and our adventures were even more alarming!

However, we arrived at last at Lustrem, the Goose's H.Q., just as two shells fell through the roof of the Chateau were the old bird lived. Needless to say (it was about 5.30 a.m. by this time) the only people left were three British officers and the old P. General himself, a pale but dignified figure, much shaken by the fact that one shell had fallen into his room, just as he was leaving the door. Not another soul anywhere to be found, for every bird had flown at the commencement of the bombardment, and no chance of discovering what was happening at the front line.

I must not tell you what happened there, but knowing our oldest Allies as I do, you can well imagine. Enough to know that the right flank became expossed to the furious onslaught of a great number of Hun divisions at 5.30 a,m, but that we clung on, as thank God, the 40th always do, for six more hours, and only retired when we had to about noon. Meanwhile, as I was talking to the pathetic remnant at the Goose's H.Q., another British officer arrived, and told me the 40th was being heavily attacked and our HQ at Croix-du-Bac shelled - and I thought it time to go home and see what was happening. .........

By the end of April 9th at the maximum point the Germans had made an advance of three and a half miles. . . . .

Excerpts taken from Malcom Brown's, The Imperial War Museum BOOK OF 1918 Year Of Victory.

Kevin in Deva

Edited November 25, 2006 by Kev in Deva

[Riley1965]

Robert,

Thanks for the photos Kevin Thanks for the History I'm getting hooked on these period photos

Doc

[Chip]

Robert,

That first photo is outstanding. Examples of Portugese troops in the field are scarce. Notice in the close-up the German medic filling out a wound tag to be affixed to the man on the ground. I have a few of these tags and though hundreds of thousands of them were filled out, few are to be found today. With this activity going on and the Germans still wearing their helmets and going for their canteens, I would assume that the battle has just ended or is still in progress. Great photo! And Kevin, thanks for the historical detail.

Chip

[Kev in Deva]

Robert,

That first photo is outstanding. Examples of Portugese troops in the field are scarce. Notice in the close-up the German medic filling out a wound tag to be affixed to the man on the ground. I have a few of these tags and though hundreds of thousands of them were filled out, few are to be found today. With this activity going on and the Germans still wearing their helmets and going for their canteens, I would assume that the battle has just ended or is still in progress. Great photo! And Kevin, thanks for the historical detail.

Chip

Hallo Chip,

with regards the picture, I think the standing Portuguese soldier is being used as a stretcher bearer, the bag around his neck holds his gas mask, and on the ground to his right, judging by the puttees / leggings appears to be another Portuguese soldier who is wounded, the soldier with the medic is clearly a German.

On the tailboard of the truck to my eyes is what also appears to be a medics tornister / pack with white circle (red-cross) on the flap. In all a great picture showing lots of details.

I attach a picture of 2 typical medals issued for WW1 to Portuguese troops.

Portuguese Victory Medal, and the Portuguese Cross of War.

Kevin in Deva

[Robert Noss]

Kevin - thanks a lot for that superb report. That story makes the photo "come alive" again. Reading what the british captain tells us, sets the photos in a new context now.

You have good eyes, Kevin. It is indeed a medic tornister at the car:

Another photo from that lot:

The inscription on the back says:

Sturm 2. Batl. 2. R.I.R. auf Lacouture

I think this photo above is also made the same day. Although the german troops are photographed in the distance, You see their tornisters and they are packed the same way as in the portugese photo.

Also the "mood" of the photo is the same.

....

[Robert Noss]

...

now a photo which is described " Riegelstellung in Lacouture"

I can not say if this is portugese material, guns and gear in that abandoned trench, but it also fits well in the report of the british capatin.

This is a perfect example how photos can be filled with live when you get to know the story behind.

Again, thanks a lot for Your efforts, Kevin.

Kind regards

Robert

Edited November 25, 2006 by Robert Noss

[Kev in Deva]

I can not say if this is portugese material, guns and gear in that abandoned trench, but it also fits well in the report of the british capatin.

This is a perfect example how photos can be filled with live when you get to know the story behind.

Again, thanks a lot for Your efforts, Kevin. Kind regards, Robert

Hallo Robert

with regards the Picture & Portuguese equipment helmet, their distinctive helmets were made, of low resistence steel in 1916, in Birmingham, England, for the "Corpo Expedicionario Portugues."

They were in green and a dark grey-green.

Kevin in Deva