Spanish cross preliminary document

[Jacques]

It seems that the day of the award ceremony, the members received provisory documents.

[Guest Rick Research]

Gordon Williamson just had a KVK2 document in this strange format, with the spaces for more than one award:

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1575...indpost&p=12157

This Spanish Cross is dated in September 1940...

I wonder if it is a REPLACEMENT document for a sailor whose originals were lost?

[Jacques]

In fact this document is sticked inside the soldbuch. but the cross is also listed in the soldbuch ????

[Jacques]

Here is a full provisory document. It exist for all the classes bronze, silver, gold with or without swords and cross with diamonds.

[Simon Orchard]

A question about the spanish cross preliminary doc. I've seen these for the bronze class and note they have ohne Schwerte. Now ive also seen one for the silver class with no further designation, ie. simply 'silver'. Would this make it with or without swords? I notice the formal doc dosen't state ohne schwerter.

[Jacques]

On the documents, when swords are not mentioned means that the cross is without swords (exemple: the large doc for spanish cross). Sometimes the mention "ohne schwert" is added on the preliminay documents.

[Simon Orchard]

In Bender's book on the Legion Condor there is an example of a gold preliminary award doc with no mention of swords yet it's captioned in the book as a with swords, which is right as none were awarded.

Could an Obergefreiter in 4./LN 88 have been awarded the silver cross without swords or must it have been with swords?

[Jacques]

I saw it too concerning the gold cross. I can't explain . But I do think that usually when the swords are not mentioned is for a cross without swords. We can accept exceptions, and the gold cross is one.

I read somewhere (Angolia ???)that the crosses without swords were awarded in silver for the officers and bronze for NCO's and privates. If your guy has a paper only with silver mentioned , I think it is again an exception for the spanish cross in silver with swords.

It is difficult to make a rule or be definitive with these documents. Not so many are available, and nothing has been writen. The dates also are an issue; the preliminary docs were also sent after the 1939 parades.

This is more my feeling than a definitive work.

jacques

[Jacques]

For exemple, this doc is for an officer (Stabsartz ) and he got the bronze cross. According to what I read , he might have received the silver cross

[Simon Orchard]

This the doc in question, part of a small but very interesting group i've just bought.

[Simon Orchard]

Just adding a proper scan of it. Other papers show he joined the LW as a vehicle mechanic in 1935

[Jacques]

Here is an interesting document for the Spanish cross in silver w/o sword. It is attributed to an interpreter attached to the A/88. Note that it has been delivered in 1940.

jacques

[Guest Rick Research]

I've never seen a German award document format like these before! Cutting off the bottom and returning that "stub" for a Final Document must be unique to these!

The fact that some of these did NOT have the bottoms torn off and mailed back in suggests ??? the late awardees might have been dead by the end of the first year of the war?

Or else just incredibly lazy!!!!

[Jacques]

this one is uncut

[Humberto Corado]

this one is uncut

hello,

one question please, ang. what rank is this???in the previous document.

thanks in advance!

Edited August 15, 2007 by Humberto Corado

[eitze]

Hello Humberto,

ang. = Angestellter

That means he was a civilian "employee" - perhaps in the bureau or some kind of technician.

greetings

eitze

[Humberto Corado]

Hello Humberto,

ang. = Angestellter

That means he was a civilian "employee" - perhaps in the bureau or some kind of technician.

greetings

eitze

thank you eitze for your help!

by the way, there is any way to track the service of a condor legion member???

Edited August 15, 2007 by Humberto Corado