Unteroffizier

[kronprinz]

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_03_2009/post-3141-1236172068.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_03_2009/post-3141-1236172068.jpg[

Warum hat diese Unteroffizier Einheit Kavaleriestiefel und Fernglas 08?

DANKE;

Krp.

[Naxos]

What is on the shoulder strap? (no spurs and big hobnails, therefore not mounted)

P.Z.5 = Pionierzug 5 ? But Pioniere had Swedish cuffs the soldiers in the above photo have Brandenburg cuffs (Infanterie)

Hardy

Edited March 4, 2009 by Naxos

[bob lembke]

At the very beginning of the war, one would think that six Pioniere, one an Unteroffizier, and probably wearing their best (only?) uniform, would, at least in part be wearing black shoulder-straps. However, by their apparent age they probably are Reserve or even Landwehr, and they may have just drawn uniforms, and received what was available. I don't think that any Landsturm were called up in August 1914. Pionier Zug 5. is sort of an "odd" unit designation, but so are many of the Landwehr and Landsturm unit names, at least to me.

Bob Lembke

[bob lembke]

Another clue. The painted backdrop, although overly dramatic, might represent the local countryside, and would be representative of only a few areas in Germany and France; the Bavarian Alps, Saxon "Switzerland", the Vosges. However, it also might suggest a dramatic destination in a studio in an area as flat as a billiards-table.

Bob Lembke

[Chip]

Bob,

There were no black pioneer straps until 1915. The pioneers went to war with gray, red piped straps.

Chip

[bob lembke]

There were no black pioneer straps until 1915. The pioneers went to war with gray, red piped straps.

Ahh, Haa! I am very fuzzy on uniform stuff, which I know you are expert on. Another (possible) clue. The Unteroffizier's cartridge pouches are visible. Didn't the Pioniere use an older style, which are distinctive, while the infantry had a newer style? Of course, there, one would think that the Landwehr, usw. also would wear older ones of various patterns. I suspect we will never know.

Bob

[Chip]

Bob,

The Patronentasche is the normal M09 that most troops would have worn. You are correct about the pioneers wearing a different style. It was the kidney shaped, so-called M87/88, which had been updated to hold two clips of ammo. The old square M88 and M95 pouches were mostly religated to reserve units during the war.

The soldiers in the photo are not pioneers. Cuffs are the wrong style and I think the cap bands are too light to be the black band pioneers wore.

Chip