Purple Heart ribbon bar

[Michael Johnson]

I have a very nice Vietnam-era ribbon set:

Silver Star

Bronze Star with V

Purple Heart

Army Commendation Medal

Army Good Conduct Medal

National Defense Medal

Vietnam Medal with 2 Stars

Vietnam Campaign Medal 1960 clasp

The question is: the Purple Heart is lacking its oak leaves. It has 3 holes, Would this indicate there should be 3 leaves, or were the pins wide enough apart to use two holes?

[Doc]

In my experience, the oak leaves from that period usually have two prongs on the back, but the prongs are so close together than they essentially go through one hole in the ribbon (then they are spread in opposite directions to hold the device to the ribbon). If you have three widely separated holes in the ribbon, I would guess that it represents 3 different devices (thus, either 3 awards, 7 [one of them being silver], 11 [two of them being silver], or 15 [a real bullet magnet]). Just going on statistics, I would bet that there should be three bronze oak leaves on it. Doc

[Michael Johnson]

Thanks Doc.

Given that he has two battle stars up, three bronze seems the most likely. I bought three, but wasn't sure how many to put up.

[Guest Rick Research]

Post scans.

[Michael Johnson]

I notice that there are actually four holes - two close together in the centre, where I suppose the first oak leaf went, then two others to the sides.

One possibility struck me - did he start with one oak leaf , and then when he got his second, moved them to the sides, leaving the centre hole empty? Did he ever get a third oak leaf? For his sakewe can hope not.

Edited June 3, 2009 by Michael Johnson

[Guest Rick Research]

I think you've got it-- moved the device in the center on the same old ribbon and put that device and the new second one spaced apart. Three holes, two devices. It'd be a tight squeeze otherwise.

[Michael Johnson]

I've often wondered how many men won both the Silver and Bronze Stars in Vietnam. Probably far too many to have any hope of identifying this man.

[Michael Johnson]

duplicate post

Edited June 3, 2009 by Michael Johnson

[W McSwiggan]

Interesting set.

Indicative of distinguished combat performance during Vietnam.

Either an Army enlisted man or a prior enlisted officer. I suspect enlisted or there would have been another BSM for meritorious service. No Air Medal - unusual because it was hard to get shot at enough to earn multiple purple hearts, a BSM for heroism & Silver Star without getting a fair amount of combat assault air mobile missions!

Finally, the order of precedence is incorrect for the period of hostilities. During the "war games", the Purple Heart ranked after the Army Commendation Medal.

The "promotion" of this award to immediately behind the BSM happened in the late 70's/early 80's as I recall.

This individual appears to have stayed in the service long enough to have had to rearrange his stuff. That said, why no additional awards of the Good Conduct?

[ItemCo16527]

I've seen the Purple Heart ribbon worn in the incorrect position probably almost as frequently as I've seen it in the correct position. The ribbons and devices all look like they're correct for the Vietnam period. The lack of multiple GCMs could mean the soldier served as an enlisted man for 3 to 5 years and then got out, or he was an officer commissioned from the ranks. No way of telling which, though.

[W McSwiggan]

Yup - possibilities almost infinite!

For those of us who continued serving, changing order of mounting on this type rack is quite simple.

Could have been enlisted who went direct commission or OCS before being entitled to second Good Conduct. Could have been "prior service" USMA type. Could have been Basic, AIT, OCS officer. Could have been enlisted veteran who simply adjusted his old rack later. Could have gone National Guard or Reserve after active duty and not qualified for indicative awards. Might even have simply discarded this rack for a new one upon award of additional stuff. Only thing we can say with a degree of certainty is this bar is not "as worn" during the Vietnam era. We'll never know.

I've seen the Purple Heart ribbon worn in the incorrect position probably almost as frequently as I've seen it in the correct position. The ribbons and devices all look like they're correct for the Vietnam period. The lack of multiple GCMs could mean the soldier served as an enlisted man for 3 to 5 years and then got out, or he was an officer commissioned from the ranks. No way of telling which, though.