Austria-Hungary Silver Merit Cross with crown

[Tim B]

Hello Josef,

No worries my friend, understand people have different schedules/commitments. We'll just have to wait and see at this point and hopefully...and if not, I will return it.

On a positive side, his PIC's are not the best on items and on the negative side, the quality does not appear to be as nice as other originals I have seen. The waiting game begins.

Tim :cheers:

[Tim B]

Hi guys,

Still waiting on the cross that started this thread but, was looking around some more and came across a couple of others that looked very similar.

Here's one that the cross and crown characteristics look to be the same style as the one I am waiting on. I see this one is marked and I am hoping once I get mine in, that one will be the same. However, I see this one has what appears to be a separate inner enamel crown section (similar to the crown on the Signum Laudis medal) and this is one of the points that concerned me initially with the one I was asking about.

Should all of these have two-piece crowns, with a separate inner enamel piece? I ask, as the one I am waiting on appears to be one-piece (looking at the PIC's) with the enamel inlaid into the crown. That may not be the case, only going off the seller's PIC'S. So, thoughts??

Thanks!

Tim

[Tim B]

Here's a close-up showing the crown and you can see daylight around the inner red section. Also, can anyone tell me who this maker is?

Tim :cheers:

[Josef Rietveld]

Hi guys,

.....

Should all of these have two-piece crowns, with a separate inner enamel piece? I ask, as the one I am waiting on appears to be one-piece (looking at the PIC's) with the enamel inlaid into the crown. That may not be the case, only going off the seller's PIC'S. So, thoughts??

Thanks!

Tim

NO, the older ones, the cross was awarded from 1849-1918, have no enamel-inlay also a lot of later pieces especially silver-merit crosses. I have NEVER seen a austrian production real GOLD merit cross with crown that had an enamel inlay inside the crown. Only gilded pieces show enamel inlay.

regards

josef

[Tim B]

Hi Josef!

Okay, good to know! I guess now, I'm just waiting to see the actual piece and go from there.

I might suggest we start a thread on these oneday, showing the multiple variations and separate good traits from bad. Of course, easier said than done.

Thanks again!

TIm

[Richarddwh]

Tim,

When I am back home I will take some pics of mine for comparison, I still think yours is good. I am currently stuck in Budapest, two flights cancelled today due to snow. But it means I might get another chance to go the Military museum in the Castle District of Buda. Had a quick look already and some very nice Austro-Hungarian medal bars, uniforms etc I could have spent hours there, curators are bit officious though. Unfortunately my camera has expired but I doubt the aforemention would permit photography.

Regards

Richard

[Tim B]

Hi Richard,

Many thanks for that! I appreciate the extra looks here, as the item will probably not reach me before Christmas unless I get really lucky. Safe travels over there, I see England is getting pounded as well as other places in Europe.

Tim

[Richarddwh]

Safely back in the UK, and I had another chance to spend another couple of hours at the Military museum in Budapest, which partly compensated two cancelled flights.

I digress, here is my example. I believe the enamal in the crown is in two parts.

[Richarddwh]

The enamel is intact just some reflection occurring. Hope this helps Tim! I've only just realised the missing cross upon the crown of mine!

Edited December 20, 2010 by Richarddwh

[Tim B]

Hi Richard,

Good to see you made it home safe! Travel over there looks horrendous.

Thanks for posting those additional PIC's. Yes, I think my concerns are going to center on whether or not the enamel on mine is inlaid into the crown and not a separate internal piece. Still waiting of course.

Thanks again!

Tim

[army historian]

Hello, all - I have a couple of questions on the Austrian Hungarian Merit Crosses. First the 1914-1918 period someone said do not have the center enameled - correct? Second I guess these were awarded to officers who did not get the War Merit Cross? I have a photo of an Hungarian Oberlieutenant wearing one with a Bavarian Order of War Merit 4th with swords. I do not know if his Merit Cross is Gilt or Silver - any suggestions? He was also an Infantry type - he also had the Gilt and silver Sigmun Landis, Karl Troop Cross, a single wound medal and the 1922 Hungarian Combat Leadership Badge. Any help would be appreciated thanks Captain Albert

Edited December 21, 2010 by army historian

[Tim B]

Well, I would say to everyone not to hold their breath waiting on the PIC's for this one. Appears the seller either never sent the item or, just now put a package in the mail to cover his butt 30 days after payment was made.

Was supposedly sent 12/13/10 and until now, nothing. I told him that I would be opening a dispute on the 7th and the evening of the 6th, the postal status changed.

From 12/13 to 01/06, both the Austrian Post and USPS both showed no record of the registration number. When I checked the status on the night of the 6th, it now shows the number being recognized in the Austrian Post and USPS now says, "Origin Post is Preparing Shipment. We have received notice that the originating post is preparing to dispatch this mail piece."

I know it's not an issue with the postal systems, as I just received another registered package from Austria 12 mles away from this guy and that one was mailed on 12/29!

Filed a dispute and told eBay I wanted a refund and will not accept the package at this point. Oh well, maybe it's for the better.

Life moves on!

Tim

[Tim B]

On a somewhat surprised and happier note, eBay already refunded my money in full this weekend. I didn't even have to escalate this into a Paypal claim as the seller escalated the dispute and wanted eBay to make a decision (in his favor). However, when eBay seen the status of the registration number on the package, they immediately sided on my side!

Seller is of course, not happy, and denies that he never sent the package. Of course, now the threats of "I'm going to do this or that". I reminded him that the package was registered and never signed for, so the issue is either with him or his post office.

Something is screwy with this guy, as the package status changed a couple of times; from the registration number "not being recognized" by either the Austrian Post or USPS for 30 days, then on the 6th of January to being just entering the system, and today...the number is not recognized in either postal system again.

I'll give it a couple more days to see if anything does show up and record the actual shipping date but, at this point, don't really believe anything is in the mail. Already informed him that I would not be accepting the package at this point and it would automatically return to him. Glad I "lost" this one after all!

Seller's name is Mike Berger. Another one of these seller's that makes his listings "private". Should have trusted my gut from the beginning. Austria seems to have problems with guys of this name (banking community).

Tim

[army historian]

Can some one please tell us what is the difference between the Silver and gilt Merit Crosses one with no enameled centers and the ones with the while enameled Centers? Which type was issued in WW1? Thanks Captain Albert

[Richarddwh]

That's a shame Tim, I agree the seller does sound rather odd and contradictory.

[Tim B]

That's a shame Tim, I agree the seller does sound rather odd and contradictory.

Thanks Richard!

Well, it would have been interesting to see the piece in hand but, trying to look on the positive side of things, at least I don't have to return it if the piece had turned out to be bad and then out additional postage (registered). I can only imagine the hassles with this guy at this point. So, it worked out and I can always find another (better?) piece anyway. No worries!

Tim