KItchener's Forage Cap?

[Luftmensch]

I've had this since the 1980s, never knowing whether to believe the story I was told. Fast forward 30 years and now I can run it by such esteemed experts as yourselves!

ALLEGEDLY, Hugh King was visiting Royal Victoria Hospital Netley and was given the following forage cap and sampler by the director. He said that Kitchener left it behind on a visit with Boer War veterans and, having an association with the Hospital, they kept it as a treasured memento.

The sampler was done by WW1 invalids after Kitchener's death and kept folded up with the cap.

I don't have a Dress Regulations, but I was told the cap is for the Inspector General of Royal Engineers, which post Kitchener occupied I don't know when. It looks like a general officer's cap to me. The sampler I noticed has "RE IG" prominently displayed at the top below "HK". Why would the sampler highlight that rank when he had more exalted?

Any daylight on these would be much appreciated.

Edited January 11, 2014 by Luftmensch

[Luftmensch]

[Mervyn Mitton]

Luftmensch - a remarkable story and two incredible items. I see no reason to doubt the history you give - however

unlikely it seems when you first read and look at the items.

The cap seems correct in it's details - and you have knowledge that he visited the Hospital. Perhaps he was asked to

leave a memory of his visit by one of the injured ?

The sampler is very rare - made in memory of a most respected officer. The making of these had died away in

Victorian times - yet here we have a dated example, made to Honour Kitchener's memory - and with full links to him.

I think the most important part is at the end, where it says ' worked by disabled soldiers.'

Yes - I think they are both genuine. Value wise - with this background and the condition they are in - I wouldn't

be surprised to see a very high value at auction - perhaps in the region of 5000/10,000 Pounds ($8000/16000).

There is also no question - they should be in a Museum , either the Imperial War Museum or, The Army Museum

in Chelsea. Perhaps you should talk to them - even if only to find out about preservation?

Thankyou for taking the time to show these - it is always a pleasure to see such rare pieces. Mervyn

[Luftmensch]

Thanks for your kind words, Mervyn.

I imfer from your answer the lace pattern and cap badge identify it as Inspector General, Royal Engineers. The record shows a publicized visit to Netley on Dec. 8, 1898, the same day the Queen visited, when he presented Sudan medals to Atbara and Omdurman veterans. He may have made less heralded visits since then. Would he have worn this cap as Field Marshal? and would he have left uncovered? I suppose he might also have sent Netley a regimental cap surplus to his needs as a memento.

I still wonder why, with all of Kitchener's exalted titles, the maker of the sampler styled him "RE IG"? Was that his highest regimental rank and therefore in keeping with traditional naming and one's first (and last) association with the regiment above all others? Perhaps the Kitchener Army veterans at Netley had this, and his cap, in mind.

Rgds

John

Edited January 13, 2014 by Luftmensch

[Mervyn Mitton]

John - this is a General's pattern forage cap - had it been for a Field Marshall, the crossed swords would have had a wreath

around them. Kitchener served in the Boer War in the higher rank - perhaps the injured included men from the Engineers ?

With regard to the Sampler - this needs some research. He probably retained his title as IG for the Engineers - you need to

find out if Netley was in-taking wounded Engineers. The other point is - if he presented the cap to the Hospital , and it was on

display - then when making the Sampler they could have used the hat as an example ?

I would suggest a letter to the Army Museum at Chelsea - with photographs - and see what they can tell you. But, please

let us know how you get-on ? Best wishes Mervyn

[Luftmensch]

Will do, Mervyn. Thanks again!