Graf

Thank you

That is some news At least you know that the Bulgarian Order was awarded during this period.

I am not sure whether you can trace from the Bulgarian site exactly when was awarded

You might dig on the Dutch site for any more information

Cheers

On 18/02/2024 at 05:05, laurentius said:

Hello Graf,

 

Thank you for your reply, I bought this medalbar a few days ago and it's coming to me as we speak.

 

 

It was advertised as a medalbar belonging to a diplomat. As a collector of both Dutch and German awards I immediately knew that this wasn't a diplomat's bar. The last decoration is the very rare Dutch House Order of Orange with only 167 awards between 1908 and 1969. This decoration was given out at the personal behest of the monarch for 'services rendered to the royal house'. We know the names of all 167 recipients. Based on this I started scanning the list on people from Hessen, since the combination and sequence of the decorations pointed in that direction. It was clear to me it had to be someone connected to the royal court in Hesse. I ended up with a list of 12 possible persons, of whom Ludwig Göbel or Goebel was the most likely candidate to me. With the help of several collectors I was able to confirm that:

 

- Ludwig Göbel received the Hessian Order of Phillip the magnanimous (2nd award) as Oberbahnhof Vorsteher in Wetzlar on 15. november 1904.

- Ludwig Göbel received the Dutch House Order of Orange (last award) on 4. April 1913 as station director in Bad Homburg vor der Höhe.

- Ludwig Göbel had received both the Red Eagle Order (3rd award) and the Verdienstkreuz für Kriegshilfe (1st award) by 1918 as Baurat in Hagenau in 1918.

 

Persons working for the railway were amongst the most decorated persons in the German Empire and this would not be an uncommon combination for someone working at the train station of Bad Homburg. Especially given the fact that many different royal families came together there. This would explain the four different orders and the Verdienstkreuz and explain the abscence of an Iron Cross. 

 

Given the rarity of the House Order I think this medalbar is identifiable and to correctly identify it to Ludwig Göbel I need to confirm (somehow) that he received the Bulgarian Civil Merit Order somewhere around 1900-1920. Any help would be appreciated.

 

Kind regards, Laurentius

Welcome

7 hours ago, Farkas said:

Thanks Tracy 

you always say something nice 🍻. 
 

Yes, I’ve been distracted, I kept starting new ones and I knew really had to finish that Karl Truppen Kreuz topic but it took ages…

 

I’m back on track now 😊

A 30.5cm artillery piece (mortar?)

May 1915

Close up

Reverse of above

 

 

 

cheers

tony 🍻

 

Nice pictures  Tony

It is a an early Overview of the Order for Civil Merit (part of my collection)

The Fifth Class Cross on the bar is the same as the one without the ribbon on the very right of the picture

You can see that  the design is the same

The crosses with the domed crown are the 1st Prince Ferdinand Issue 1891-190 Once the Prince Ferdinand proclaimed himself as King of Bulgaria  in 1908  the crown changed, however the cross design staid the same till 1918 ( In this year King Ferdinand abdicated in favour of his oldest son Boris, who became King Boris III)

I hope there could be a reference somewhere to bring more information for your research

In a book published by Bulgarian author Todor Petrov in 2005 there are tables of the numbers of awarded Bulgarian orders during the period 1880-1908 According to this book The Fifth Class of the Order for Civil Merit was awarded to 288 foreign nationals. Unfortunately this period is for the Princely Issue -with the domed crown (the picture of the two Fifth class crosses for man and ladies) I hope some information does exist for the King's period  1908-1918

Thank you for the information I hope any of the members from Bulgaria could help It is very interesting.

Only thing I can tell you that the Fifth Class of the Order for Civil merit could be dated in this period It looks as the Second issue King Ferdinand 1908-1918  with King's Crown.

Once you got the bar I will be very grateful if you can send the photo of the reverse

12 hours ago, laurentius said:

Dear fellow collectors,

 

I am doing research into Baurat Ludwig Göbel. I was wondering if anyone could conform that he received the Bulgarian Civil Merit Order fifth class? I was able to confirm his Dutch and German awards, but my unfamiliarity with Bulgarian awards prevents me from dong so. Thanks in advance. 

 

Kind regards, Laurentius 

Hi It will be very difficult to trace any low grade Bulgarian  award

More likely if you have to any Dutch materials it will be easier

What information do you have for the Bulgarian award Do you have any photos

Regards

Graf

On 05/02/2024 at 19:16, Frank Japan said:

Gentlemen,

 

how could I tell the year this one was awarded?

 

The seller is describing it as WW1ish.

 

The prerequisite would be it is a real one.

 

Thanks & regards,

 

Frank

Hi contrary to the other Belgium Orders It is sometimes difficult to point out the exact period of the Order of the crown

This Knight you have listed is real and could be from this period or a bit newer For sure it is not a modern one

They are not very expensive -around 30-40 Euro the most for this class

Regards

Here is a nice Commander

Interesting photo of medical Officer with Red Cross badges

2 hours ago, eurorders said:

I always wondered how the jewelers of these got that red enamel inside the crown? Very effective design in its outcome appearance

Hi

Yes indeed very nice design The Red enamel is a separate two parts piece ( metal frame with the cred enamel backed on top} Together with the arms and the cross are assembled  to a rod that is attached to the both sides on the bottom of the crown.  The cross  can swing back and forth

On 06/01/2024 at 02:44, Jstrom said:

Very nice

On 11/01/2024 at 03:55, ilieff said:

Major General Asen Nikolov

 

It is interesting to see how he earned a grand total of 4 military order decorations during his military career. 

 

Soldier's cross 4th class - for the war with Serbia in 1885 (only weeks before he was appointed junior officer, hence a cross and not an actual order) 

Order 4th class - for the Balkan wars

Order 4th class (1st grade) and 3rd class (1st grade) - for the Great war

 

I think it's impressive.

I agree very impressive

Fake Bulgaria Order for Bravery -1st Class listed and sold three times on eBay Germany

When asked the Dealer rejected my claim it is fake Keeps re.listing and selling for the last three months

The price was what he hoped to get The same Dealer is selling many fake German Decorations including medal bars like the one listed in this thread

Thank you

Nice items.

The bag is rarer then the medal

On 13/10/2023 at 02:27, larsb001 said:

Stefan, tanks for the feedback. As mentioned, when I bought the group I was given the provenience, and this could of course be wrong. So Nyström could be an possibility, but it's mentioned that he got the Gold medal, and not the Gold medal with Crown. Who knows?

 

And now to something else!

 

Not so long ago I got two different examples of one of the rarer miniatures, the Badge of the Herald of the Order of the Sword (Tjänstetecken för Härold), both in gold. They are identical on both front and reverse ...

 

 

These go very well together with the similar badge for the Order of the North Star ...

 

 

And again very well together with the similar badge of the Order of Wasa ...

 

 

And last, very well together the the Badge of the State Herald of the Order of the Seraphim ...

 

Very nice minis

On 26/12/2023 at 11:57, steveBobby said:

Greeting Graf and all members！

Wish all members have a happy holiday.

Sincerely

Setve

Thank you

35 minutes ago, Harry the Mole said:

Very nice!

Thank you

My latest addition - Very early Officer in 18 carat Gold. Military Division by G. Wolfers

71mm x 39 mm  18.5 gr Very light and fine construction

Usually those crosses are unmarked

my Guess around 1900 period

On 26/12/2023 at 10:16, Farkas said:

Yes, well said Sir!

 

Happy Christmas all…

 

tony🍻

Thank you

I wish Merry Christmas to all members of the club

I really enjoyed the being a member I felt the Club as a Family and I was happy to be part of the Family

I enjoyed sharing  knowledge, information and many moments  with you THANK YOU

I wish all members Health, Happiness and may new valuable to their collection

Kind Regards

Graf

On 07/12/2023 at 11:43, steveBobby said:

These are very rare photos! Very beautiful collection! ！

 

I agree

On 19/08/2023 at 17:15, Graf said:

More pictures I "like the way the aged the new box

This PLM is for sale again If you missed the last time now is your chance (just kidding0

Also many fake German states items This Guy is very arrogant when questioned about the originality of the items

On 19/08/2023 at 08:27, Graf said:

Fake 1st Class of the Order for Bravery on eBay.de

Although  i have to admit it is good copy it has many features that can trick only new collector

- The  additional ring is missing

The Central medallion has too many dots

The lion is very bad quality to be first Class The swords were wit wrong handles

The back cap is wrong

The pin  although look good, is not a correct

 The Cross looks too shiny and new i suspect the enamel is new soft one i do not think that the seller will test it if asked to do so.

The Seller claims  that the Order is Original gilded silver I doubt

 

It is scary that the fakers can produce such good copy

The seller also sells few other fakes including well known  PLM  supposedly  made by Wagner  Has the marks however it is not near the quality of the Original -still attracted many bidders

Here is a well known original 1st Class

Attention!!!!!!!

The seller re-listed this item again He still insists it is original made by "other maker'

H  is using  a recent Auction by Herman Historica as example

The item is FAKE

He listed also many German Items also Fakes Including the same Fake PLM supposedly by Wagner

My advise Keep away from this Auction and seller

On 07/12/2023 at 02:10, Kriegsmarine Admiral said:

Thank you Graf for the interesting and detailed explanation.

 

Here is the other photo:

1: Kapitän zur See Hellmuth Heye, Chief of Staff of the Admiral „Z“ (14 February 1941-03 April 1941)
2: General-leytenant (Lieutenant General) Nikola Totev Markov, Inspector of the Infantry of the Bulgarian Army (1938-11 August 1941)
3: Admiral Karlgeorg Schuster, Admiral „Z“ (04 March 1941-03 April 1941)
4: Herbert Freiherr von Richthofen, German Ambassador to Bulgaria (1939–1941)
5: General-leytenant (Lieutenant General) Nikola Petkov Hadzhipetkov, Chief of Staff of the Bulgarian Army (10 December 1938-11 August 1941)
6: Oberst Hans Bruckmann, German Military Attaché in Sofia (01 November 1937-19 December 1942)
7: Oberstleutnant Carl-August von Schoenebeck, Military Advisor and Air-Attaché at the German Embassy in Sofia, at the same time Chief of the Luftwaffe-Mission in Bulgaria (01 September 1939-06 September 1944)

Very nice.photo

I will try to get the third general name

From the photos it looks like his position was not as high as the others, however still high enough to be chosen for the meeting.

Regards