filfoster

"...just wearing the decorations from straight ribbons, or do you actually mean the mounting method where the gongs are resting (and fixed) on a piece of the straight ribbon?"

The major feature is the straight ribbon, vice the German method of a folded ribbon.  Whether the medals are fixed or not, isn't the feature I am concentrating on.  I suppose the field marshals' portraits (Wolseley and Roberts) show fixed medals on straight ribbons.

I had not previously noticed that Edward VII's medals were not 'court mounted' (straight ribbons) but instead, on folded, Prussian style mounting.

I think this is a fair guess but I have seen earlier examples, e.g. Viscount Wolseley: 

...and Lord Roberts:

Thanks, Daniel. Perfect example of what I was looking for. 

YEs, this is a famous photo and I have actually replicated that bar.  No way to know if they are detachable gongs, although I think an example of this medal bar survives in a museum at one of the castles. 

I hope some will post photos of Prussian officer medal bars that have detachable medals, e.g. show the hooks on the reverse, vs. purely early style ribbon bars or medal bars made in this style but with permanently attached medals.

3 hours ago, 91-old-inf-reg said:

Well, I couldn’t find any other photos of Willy du with that particular medal bar, however here are some other examples:

Well, that last one seems to prove the point. Still, It'd be fun to see some other examples of officer medal bars in this style. Thanks to all who contributed thus far.

I am inclined to think these are simply ribbon bars per the regulations for the trapezoidal form, rather than a bar with attachment hooks for medals. 

Well, that last one seems to prove the point. Still, It'd be fun to see some other examples of officer medal bars in this style. Thanks to all who contributed thus far.

Willy 2 is wearing a RUSSIAN uniform, but with many Prussian awards. Are there any photos of him wearing this bar with German uniform?

Any higher rank Prussian bars?

Daniel: As always, you come through!  Can you show a few more of these?  I would like to use this style for a Prussian colonel uniform display, circa  mid 1870's-1900.

Alex K: Thanks!  I am recreating this medal bar (not easy or cheap, even with the available repros...No one makes a knight's badge Hesse Philip the Magnanimous or monogamous or whatever), so this is an important detail.  I do have a repro post WW1 George V bar in the court style, so this will be nice contrast. 

When did the 'court mounting' style begin for English medal mounting?

I just noticed that the mounting of these medals is in the 'Prussian' style, not the later British Court mounting style. Am I correct?

That is what I had thought until recently, a knowledgeable person expressed this belief.  I will survey the early medal bars to see if there are any obvious officer bars there, for example, having a higher grade of the Red Eagle or Crown order or something like that. 

Well, this is interesting, and perhaps deserving of our time to explore. I just surveyed the medal bars in the thread listed for 1870 and older bars in the mega medal bar section and could not find a single one mounted that way that was clearly for an officer.  There were at least two that had a Red Eagle 4th class, without any additional embellishments, eg crowns or swords, which would be rare enough for an enlisted man, but not a single one, mounted that way, that included any higher order gong. So....

I invite anyone to show here examples of officer medal bars of the period 1870's and before, mounting detachable medals.

I apologize for asking this, if it's commonly known (but not by me!): Is it the case that Imperial German medal bars with detachable medals were only worn by enlisted men, not officers?

I apologize for asking this, if it's commonly known (but not by me!): Is it the case that medal bars with detachable medals were only worn by enlisted men, not officers?

Thank you. I have the infantry volumes, but not this set. I will have to invest!

That would seem to settle it, then. Is there a good reference book for this?

GreyC: Thank you for this information.  Do you know why he wore shoulder cords with white underlay, instead of the light yellow?

No one knows? He supposedly held a reserve officer (major) commission in something called the 1st Reserve Heavy Cavalry Regiment or 1st Heavy Reserve Reiter Regiment that is supposed to have worn uniforms similar to the 7th Kurisassier Regiment. It may be the authors had this wrong and he was rather, a reserve officer in the 7th Magdeburg Kuirassier Regiment No. 7.  

Anyone know anything about this? King William gave him a promotion to Generalmajor I guess because of his civil rank.

OK, why do the shoulder boards on Bismarck's cuirassier uberrock look white?  Photographs at this time caused the light yellow to look very dark so the yellow collar and piping is dark.  Is white the Korps color, not regimental color, that would have been worn for the shoulder cords underlay? I thought that applied only to infantry and artillery.  Is white some special color denoting his civil rank or alasuite status?

....and yes, I've seen the museum photo. The boards look not original to the coat: see how they overhang the shoulders?

OK, so now it's:

1. Order of the Bath

2. Order of the Star of India

3. Order of St George and St. Michael

4. Victorian Order

5. Order of the Indian Empire

6. Order of St. Vladimir

7. Order of Dannebrog (silver merit cross)

8. Order of the Redeemer

9. Prussian Order of the Crown 3rd Class

10. Austrian 'Marianerkreuz'

11. Hessian Order of Philip the Magnanimous

12. Saxe-Ernestine House Order

13. 2nd Empire Medaille Militaire

14. French Red Cross 1870-1871

On 31/08/2021 at 09:16, Great Dane said:

According to Wikipedia it's 3rd class (not that Wikipedia is necessarily always correct...)

That looks more like a 3rd class in the photo.

Is his Prussian crown a 4th or 3rd class ?   

I accept this medal as one on his medal bar pictured above. Its place on the bar, ahead of the French Red Cross decoration makes sense.

Thanks for the photos...The Prussian Crown 3rd with the Red Cross will be a tough one to find as a replica copy, let alone an original.

Do you have a photo or illustration of that decoration? I know what the 'ordinary' Crown order 4th looks like...

Using Great Dane's conjecture, it's:

1. Order of the Bath

2. Order of the Star of India

3. Order of St George and St. Michael

4. Victorian Order

5. Order of the Indian Empire

6. Order of St. Vladimir

7. Order of Dannebrog (silver merit cross)

8. Order of the Redeemer

9. ?

10. Austrian 'Marianerkreuz'

11. Hessian Order of Philip the Magnanimous

12. Saxe-Ernestine House Order

13. 2nd Empire Medaille Militaire

14. French Red Cross 1870-1871

So...the trick is #9   Are the points on the cross arms 'beveled', not sharp? That would narrow it down.