Claudio

Dear forumites,

I want to show a Godet bar of a personality; GFM Erhard Milch (the whole group - documents, papers, 2 Doppelabzeichen with Brilliants, ribbon and medal bar, was for sale on HH catalogue a couple of years back, for mere Eur 350'000.- + commission.... not surprisingly it didn't sell, although the historical value IMHO could have been higher than the price asked).

Look at the the details also on the double-row ribbon bar... I'm sure also quite typical Godet manufacture! ;-)

Enjoy.

ciao,

Claudio

I looove these bars with the Finnish Freiheitskreuz and that class, it's even rarer.... I want it! ;-)

Great group would that be, if it was still all together.... :-(

C

I don't know you guys, but when I re-read Rick's educated comments, full of wit and good humour, I get very sad, thinking that he's no more among us.... ((((

Interesting questions, but even more is to know if that very bar survived WW2 and post war.... Maybe it lies still within his family (see also http://studiengruppe.blogspot.ru/2011/12/hanno-von-kemnitz-der-sohn-mathilde.html )

Great bar, Tilo! You get all the most interesting ones, you lucky dog... Seriously the Order of the Wendish Crown on a bar is very seldom seen. Beautiful... what else to say?

Thanks a lot for researching it! That's great...

I knew that he likely hasn't got anything to do with anti-partisan/commissar/jewish actions on the Eastern Front... old school kind of professional officer... and Ritter! :-)

ciao,

C

Dear Forumites,

Since you should be in this form quite educated in this matter, and because I am visiting Bucarest this weekend I was wondering if there are any interesting sites or museums to be visited where I can find nice orders or military uniforms? I would be very interested.

Thanks in advance for your most precious inputs... it's very much appreciated!

ciao,

Claudio

Thanks Bernhard, I think the photo is even older than that... For sure it was taken well before 1939, very likely between 1934-36. In fact he is wearing a medal bar not on a Waffenrock, but on a Reichswehr style tunic. Furthermore I don't remember to have spotted a Hindenburg cross on it (FEK), but I might be wrong, and the 4th decoration I'm pretty sure is the Chilean merit order (1 EK, 2 BMVO 4x, 3?, 4 Chile NVO, 5?).
Since there weren't soo many MMVO wearer and the combination is quite unique, I think it might quite easy to find for the wizard researchers on this forum... ;-)

Dear forumites,

I found this interesting pictures of a senior officer wearing his medal bar and the MMVO at his 2nd tunic's button hole... Can be identified? There was no description of this officer in the museum... what I found interesting and quite strange that this officer's photo was placed in a room where there were exposed memorabilia about the holocaust and the nazi racial policy in the occupied Ukraine... Maybe this officer hasn't anything to do with it... they could have just put it there because it look so nice and so German "nazi" looking... However I could be wrong.

It would be nice to be educated on this... :-)

Thanks in advance for all your most appreciated inputs!

ciao,

C

maybe a Mecklenburg-Strelitz unit or a Prussian unit connected to Mecklenburg?

http://www.ehrenzeichen-orden.de/deutsche-staaten/kreuz-fur-auszeichnung-im-kriege-1-klasse.html

Colin Freiherr von Halkett (22.11.1867-30.08.1924), Commander IR 182 16.02.1916- 08.1916

Superb group... I like especially the Bulgarian green order, which is also so beautifully confirmed of the photo and the ZVO1Kl... too bad that the medallion on the back is missing! :-(

What would the medals be worth as singels with no background info?

Hi Chris,

I will trying to put a value, but some of the medals on the bar are really rare, but some very common... it all depends also what an amateur and collector of non-combatant bars or specifically collecting orders and medals of a single miniature German state pre-1918 (like Schaumburg-Lippe) would be prepared to shell out to get such a bar. If you are the only one to want something like that, then it's going to be comparatively cheap, but if there're just 2 of you who really want this bar, in auction can get very easily out of hand and very emotional and impulsive.

• SM VK am Nichtkämpferband, I would say no more than 120 Euro, also if that non-combatant ribbon is really very rare...
• Ludwig-Kreuz... pretty common... Eur 40.-
• Hl. St. Michael Orden 4th class with crown... again also here some Bavarian collectors can get very emotional, normally I would pay 600-800 Euro for that
• non-official commemorative jubilee medal for monarchist... well no definite price on it, but with that nice and rare ribbon I'd say 50-60 Euro?
• Prinzregent Luitpold Medal... cheap... very common in Bavaria... Eur 40.-
• Anhalt Hönigbär ;-) 1st class... mmmhhh... there are undervalued... quite a lot of "post-war" pieces around... an original would surely fetch about 600-800 Eur... not so collectable, maybe because there are no enamels and it's not cross-shaped
• Schaumburg-Lippe order for arts and sciences first class... well there are really rare, especially on bars! it all boils down to demand and offer, but I would say 1000-1500 Euros?

Total about Eur 3'000/3'500.- including 10% price increase because there is a name to it. Personally I would rather spend Eur 3000 then 3500, but it depends how much you want to have it in your collection.

ciao,

Claudio

aha... that's why I didn't buy it! ;-)

here it is...

… ich wurde in meiner Sammlerkarriere genug gestraft worden…

easy….

Hausorden der Rautenkrone – Bruststern

http://www.ehrenzeichen-orden.de/deutsche-staaten/hausorden-der-rautenkrone-bruststern-vergl-oek-2068.html

It's not particularly the mint conditions that I'm looking for… the construction of the bar, the combination of the awards and its plausibility … and last but not least who sells it! I've been burned a few times by some "premium" and "reputable" dealers or auctioneers, therefore I'm quite cautious… ;-)

yeah… we're two banging their heads… thinking that it was for sale in front of our eyes during more than 2 years, also on his webpage… As you rightly said I was a bit turned off of the quite crude bar construction on the back… sometimes being "anal" doesn't pay off! (((

was it on Weitze's table at Gunzenhausen?

Very nice bar… I also thought he must have been some sort of an artist (actor, singer,…). For sure he didn't have an uniform to wear the bar, so he had a civilian attire (Tuxedo) medal bar.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felix_von_Kraus

http://www.historische-daten.de/projekte/museum/sterne/kraus.htm

and here is one of my favorites.

The bar of Generalleutnant Johannes Zukertort.

That's a beauty, Dete… especially also with the ribbon bar. Any pictures of the back? ;-)

ciao,

C

So many splendid Weimar Era bars... thanks for showing them! It doesn't bother me at all, if from time to time, you can see such bars with no EK, since these EKs were "recycled" to assemble new bars after 1934-35, according to the new rules, which prohibit to wear non-official Weimar era veteran decorations, although some were allowed to be worn (see Schlesischer Adler, Baltic cross... etc.)

@ Jean-Sam: love your 4 placed frack bar... look at the sewing of the lower ribbon on the back... so much work in it! ;-) Also very nice the one of the 16th IR... only one "official" medal on the bar (LW long service medal). If you decide to part with them let me know... ;-) Just kidding! Enjoy them as much as I do!

Thanks also for re-activate this very interesting (at least to me) thread!

ciao,

Claudio

Really a great story behind a very attractive ribbon and the photos… as you said; a true hero!

Thanks Chris for the images, thank you Adler1 for your comment... I think your first officer's tschako has a correct front emblem plate (model to fit tschakos, a bit smaller and better designed). The second and mine are just plain infantry emblem plates, a bit bigger.

I don't know if vent holes must necessarly be on it, but I would prefer so, if we speak of officer's tschakos: maybe in earlier examples they come without? Hard to believe that... furthermore, my next questions, when were such tschakos emblem plates introduced? Doesn't look a bit too new my tschako interior if it was an earlier model without side vent holes?

C

See the differences with Chris' Tschako? Quite evident...

BTW great Tschako Chris!