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    waldo

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    Posts posted by waldo

    1. Servus Eric,

      is the front medallion made of gold? 
      If it is not made of gold but is only gold-plated, the outer edge of 
      the lower cross arm on the backside must be wider. Since the cross 
      you are showing does not have a wider border, it can only be an 
      original if the medallion is made of gold.
      The cross you are showing comes from the manufacturer Leser. The 
      enamel seems good. In the appendix an MVK 1st class with swords for 
      comparison. 
      The last picture shows the widened edge of a reader's cross, which has 
      a gold-plated front medallion. Such crosses were made from 1917, as 
      real gold awards were no longer allowed.

      Best regards

      Walter

      
       
      
       

      MVK 1 X VS u RS k.jpg

      2MVK 1 mit Schw. Leser RS.jpg

    2.  
      Hello Eric,
      
      I'm sorry, this is not an original. Originals were only made by Leser and 
      Hemmerle and they are all very early productions of excellent quality. The 
      front medallions were always made of gold, 3-part at Hemmerle, 1-part at Leser.
      Your piece is from the 
      manufacturer Weiss and was subsequently upgraded.
      A total of 146 pieces were awarded, of which 138 were on war merit ribbon 
      and 8 on war ribbon. 
      MVKs 1st class with crown and swords have been imitated for many decades to 
      the detriment of collectors. Loaned originals must always look like the 
      pictures below.
      
       
      First a peace by Hemmerle, next from Leser, finally, a detailed 
      picture of the Leser-cross where you can see the excellent quality 
      of the enamelled gold medallions.

      Many Greetings from Bavaria

      Walter

      
       

      MVK 1 Kr X Hemmerle und Leser VS u RS.jpg

      MVK 1KrX Leser VS u RS k.jpg

      MVK 1 Kr X 004.JPG

    3. ?

      Anyone who deals with the Bavarian Military Merit Medal 1870/71, of 
      course, knows the daring story of Franz Dettenhofer from the 3rd 
      Chevaulegers Regiment:
      It was about 5 o'clock now; the darkness that had already set in, 
      intensified by a thick fog, made it difficult to see beyond 100 
      steps.
      
      Around 5:30 a.m., Chevauleger corporal Franz Dettenhofer from 
      Vötting, Freising District Office, the 4th squadron of the 3rd 
      Chevauleger Regiment, was ordered to investigate whether the 
      last-mentioned battery was still in its previous position or not. 
      He immediately rode with 11 men and went ahead in the swarm. The 
      little group was still less than a quarter of an hour from where 
      they left when the left-most Chevaulegers got fires. The corporal 
      was now pulling his team together and trotting in the direction 
      where the shots had come from. In the vicinity of about 70-80 paces 
      from the enemy, Dettenhofer noticed about 25-30 men of French 
      infantry escorting Bavarian prisoners, including some officers.
      One of the prisoners called Dettenhofer benevolently: "Chevaulegers,
      we are caught, ride back, otherwise you will be the same", while at 
      the same time the French soldiers started shooting at the Bavarian 
      riders. "Nothing is caught with us," replied the corporal, said to 
      his people "strike what you can" and fell on the enemy with them 
      from all sides. He killed 8 men, made 14 prisoners and freed the 
      Bavarian 3 officers and 14 men. Favored by the darkness, none of 
      the Chevaulegers was killed or wounded. So the cheeky attack, 
      carried out with real cavalry determination, happily knocked 
      everyone out again. The officers also included a badly wounded man 
      who four Chevaulegers had to carry. First Dettenhofer went to the 
      place where the Bavarians had to leave their weapons and their
      luggage, then with his liberated and prisoners to the Chevaulegers 
      bivouac in La Banery.
      The following day, December 8, the division of the 3rd Chevaulegers 
      Regiment was just in reserve when one of its officers took the 
      opportunity to introduce Dettenhofer and his subordinates from 
      yesterday to the men of the Infantry Division Staff, on what 
      occasion he did so Congratulations on the Prussian Iron Cross from 
      several sides in advance. And he also received its 2nd class, 
      because the brave Dettenhofer had already earned the two Bavarian 
      military merit medals, the silver one at Sedan on September 1, 
      where he showed great determination in transporting dispatches on a 
      very threatening relay line the golden one, because he volunteered 
      on September 25 to fill the relay post in Bourcay, which was very 
      endangered by franchireurs, fearlessly claimed this post and on 
      September 26 several important letters from the 4th Prussian Cavalry
      Division in Pithiviers were under threat Relay routes brought to 
      Arpajon. Here, as on other important ordnance steps, he repeatedly 
      demonstrates unusual courage and prudence.

      (translated with google)

      
       
      
       

       

      
       
    4. No, the list does not include matrikelnumbers. The number at the 
      end is the number under which the member of the MMJO is listed 
      in this booklet. See above.
      The only published matriculation numbers known to me so far are 
      in the Schrettinger.
      Unfortunately my English is not good and I have to rely on Google. 
      I'll try it again:
      
      This booklet was published by the order in 1927 and distributed to 
      the members. This includes all officers awarded the MMJO in 
      alphabetical order with their deeds. Furthermore you can see the 
      ranking within the individual classes. I attach the table of 
      contents as an attachment.
      
       
      
       
      
       

      img949.jpg

    5. Servus Christophe, No. 108 in the list at Kaufmann is not the 
      matriculation number but the serial number in this book where 
      it is listed. Sh. Picture attached.
      Kaufmann had the RK with the number 24, that's correct.
      Many Greetings from Bavaria 
      Walter

      img947.jpg

      The Max Joseph Order published this book (booklet) itself in 1927 
      and distributed it to its members. My copies are from the MMJO and 
      PlM owner v. Haasy, retired major general and from Ritter von 
      Grauvogl, whom I was allowed to collect personally from his grandson
      alongside a copy of the Schrettingers. 
      
      Here a cheap photocopy of such a booklet is offered.
      
       
      
       
      
       
    6. Maybe a few comments on the subject. Ritter von Hopffer had the RK 
      with the matriculation number 20. The references in Kramer do not 
      refer to the matriculation number. Epp had the RK with the number 268 
      and not 286. The RK with the number 286 was awarded only once in 1814
      to a Russian (Schrettinger S. 68, Rapatel, Nr. 10 at the RK). 
      Order decorations of current members (i.e., status 1882) of the MMJO
      and their previous owners can be found in the Schrettinger on pages 
      74 - 77.
       
      The purpose of the matriculation numbers was for a member of the 
      MMJO to find out who was allowed to wear this medal before him. The 
      order of the awards was important for the "Ordenspension" (Monthly 
      payment). These only existed for a certain number of members.
      An overview of this ranking can be found in 
      
      "Der Bayerische Militär-Max-Joseph-Orden im Weltkrieg 1914/1918, 
      Teil III, Anlage 1". 
      
      To my knowledge, this is the only publication of a ranking.
      Attached is a scan of this list. Sorry for my bad english.

      img942.thumb.jpg.a869865405a6df00887bc8baa7467511.jpgimg943.jpg

       

      img945.jpg

       

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