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    922F

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    Posts posted by 922F

    1. Dear Alex,  For the first time I see this thread.  Otherwise I would have responded much earlier.  As many others noted, you have done a beautiful thing.  As one who had the enjoyment of knowing Rick for years, I echo their sentiments concerning him as well as your  positive commemorating action in making this document available to the public.  Most sincere thanks to you!

    2. Owain thank you for your images!  May be able to find someone with old Spink supplied ribbons for you; will send you a note when/if located.  Someone in the UK offered possibly reproduction Bahawal ribbons a while ago.  

      An earlier post in a thread I can't find now illustrates one of the last Nabob's ribbon bars, no longer in my hands.  Images below may interest......

      First belonged to a staffer, 2nd an adj.  & 3rd (querishi) a ...I forgot!!  Have to look up names/ranks.  One of them at least is in the attached photo.  A CBE accompanies the Querishi lot but although obtained from the family believe that's not consistent with it.  Somewhere I have the last Bahawalpur Chief Justice's Bahawal neck badges and an again doubtful CBE but no image readily to hand.

      If you can track down a copy of  Nazeer Ali Shah's  Sadiqnamah: The History of Bahawalpur State, Lahore: Maktaba Jadeed 1959 the photo section quite worth seeing.  I do not have a copy unfortunately.

      ba39 001.jpg

      ba34 001.jpg

      tesilidir1 001.jpg

      querishi 001.jpg

      Nabob and friendscomposite.jpg

    3. The Zimmermann center resembles Austrian examples.

      Do not have access to Jacob's book now, perhaps someone else can supply information from it.  I remember Jacob reporting Zimmermann as being active from at least the 1930's, making German, Romanian and Bulgarian awards. Rick Research believed Zimmermann began much earlier maybe late 1880's-90's.  Rick's thought now makes more sense since this Sun & Lion dates before the 1930's! [Use of term Hofjuwelier another indicator]

      The factory was destroyed during WW II--damaged items from that factory debris have been offered for sale for at least 5 years.  They include full size and miniature decorations from various German states', Czech, Zanzibar, Yugoslavia, Greece, and many other countries.  Zimmermann's held LDO and Lieferant number 20 [varient number L52] from 1941-45.

    4. Lightening Strikes!!!

      For those interested in this thread--hold onto your hats!!  A vendor seems to have gotten into Johnson's archive.

      The matrix for these medals just appeared on Italian evBay staring at a mere 100 euros!  See:

      sc1-34) MATRICI PER MEDAGLIA GIOVANNI CARLO II ORDINE DEL LENTASIO ANNI 1930

      Numero oggetto eBay:  223995816737

      I'm certain that these cost considerably more to cut than the opening offer price...  

       

       

      s-l1600.jpg


    5. Attached below find the document copy.  

      As to Pat66‘s images, this type insignia did not appear on the market until 2014 at the earliest to my knowledge.  I have studied this Order since 1970 and never saw such pieces until they were offered on German eBay.  By 2016-7 they appeared on French and U.S. eBay.  Rick Research, the guru of this award here on GMIC and elsewhere [some material links below], tracked down the originator.  In one of his posts he exposes the chain of evidence.  Unfortunately I could not find his specific post on the point at this time.  Seem to recall that the pieces came out of Poland or Russia.

      The Bagration-Mukhraneli Royal House of Georgia website http://www.royalhouseofgeorgia.ge/p/eng/451/order-queen-tamar-order-history reports the following the regarding the Order:   

      This award was made official by the Democratic Republic of Georgia in 1918 and recognized as an order of merit. The Order was abolished by the Communists, but its national significance was such that H.R.H. Prince Irakly – at the petition of the Union of Traditionalist Georgians – restored it and proclaimed himself Grand Master, with the consent of his father H.R.H. Giorgi XIII who was Head of the Royal House in 1942.

      Comment—Does this suggest a 1942 date for reactivating the Order?  Rick Research spent years trying to verify this information in general and the date in particuliar.  Efforts included discussions with various experts including Dr. Klietmann, contacting the Royal House and Georgian monarchist groups.   Nowhere did he find evidence of this claim.

       
      It was then awarded to Georgians of the Diaspora and some members of the European royalty, among whom stand out the Head of the Imperial House of Russia HIH Grand Duke Wladimiro Kirilovich and the Head of the House of Borbón-Sevilla, Duke Francisco de Borbón y de Borbón, who was already an effective collaborator at the time.

      Comment---Rick Research attempted to verify HIH Grand Duke Wladimiro Kirilovich and Duke Francisco de Borbón y de Borbón as Order recipients, again without success.  Efforts included contacts with both families and close scrutiny of 100s of images of these men. Rick could not find any information regarding awards to Georgians of the Diaspora, including among his Georgian monarchist informants.  He did find much information regarding awards of the Order of the Sacred Tunic of Our Lord during the period in question. 


      Upon the death of H.R.H. Prince Irakly [October 1977], his son H.R.H. Giorgi XIII did not want to make any more concessions from this Order for reasons of discretion, and it remained inactive.  


      Given these historical precedents, recently H.R.H. Davit Bagrationi has resolved to reincorporate her fully into the Equestrian Heritage of the Royal House of Georgia, awarding it a new Constitutional Letter and conceding some appointments.  

      Comment---Philip Eagleton, CEO of the insignia manufacturing firm WORTH, came into contact with H.R.H. Davit Bagrationi regarding the Order in 2007-9.  A proposal to revive the Order occurred at that time.  Eagleton prepared preliminary insignia sketches and commissioned an in depth research effort.  In the end, WORTH lost the manufacturing agreement to Cejalvo.    See http://www.condecoracionescejalvo.es/noble-decorations.html  for images of their Tamara insignia, apparently based on Eagleton’s designs.

      Ref:   
      http://www.royalhouseofgeorgia.ge/p/eng/451/order-queen-tamar-order-history

      http://www.omsa.org/files/jomsa_arch/Splits/1983/12099_JOMSA_Vol34_6_34.pdf

      Addenda to "Georgian Order of Saint Tamara Award. Document" 

      https://www.omsa.org/files/download.php?file=JOMSA_Vol28_10.pdf&stream=true&year=1977

      Georgian Order of Saint Tamara Award. Document  

      Dr. K.G. Klietmann  "Das ’Abzelchen’ und der ’Orden der Konigin Thamar’ in Georgien 1916 und 1918", Ordenskunde #23, 1964 

       

      I would be remiss to omit mention of the Republic of Georgia’s state honor The Order of Queen Tamara (თამარ მეფის ორდენი).  A decree of the Parliament of Georgia № 1553 dated July 31, established the award.  The Order may be conferred ONLY on females for outstanding services to the people and the homeland.  The Order of Queen Tamara is awarded with a cash prize of 4,000 lari.
      https://www.president.gov.ge/geo/saqartvelo/sakhelmcifo-jildoebi.aspx


      I hope that this presentation proves useful.

      If anyone has any information or images relating to alleged 1942-1977 Tamara Order usage or bestowals please share them.  I would welcome any evidence that the insignia type Pat66 illustrates dates before 2014.    That type has been seen with dark blue and light blue soft enamel color centers, two different sorts of star rays and two different type reverse pins.   
       

      tam 1 001.jpg

    6. Welcome Georgia on my Mind!  And Pat66 as well!

      Have you seen threads, The World's Most BIZARRE Award-- A New Chapter!, GEORGIAN ORDER OF QUEEN TAMARA BREAST STAR 3RD CLASS, My First Tamara, Tamara Resurgent, and many others?  If not, just enter Tamara into GMIC's search engine.  Rick Research sent me a photocopy of a Tamara document issued in Paris by an exile committee hand written on a half-sheet of paper.  If you cannot find that image here in an existing thread, I could share a copy of the copy. 

      Bryansk1959 beat me to the punch!  Pat66's image illustrates one of the complete fake Tamaras that first appeared within the past few years.  To my knowledge, these first showed up on German eBay and exist in two major varieties [depending on type of star rays and pins].  Cigarette cases bearing this type center have been making the rounds too.

      Seems there are 2 more or less well known claimants to the Georgia throne, each with 3 Orders at their disposal.   Tamaras presented by Prince Davit, made by Cejalvo of Madrid, resemble Bryansk1959's images.  Prince Nugzar does not seem to presently use an Order of Tamara.  GMIC archives contain material on Prince Davit's awards, I don't know there’s information on  Prince Nugzar's here but you can Goggle each by name and get full details..  

    7.  

      An unidentified award image appears midway through the page 2 discussion of Burkino Faso awards [Posted May 29, 2014---topic link included].  The first image below depicts the item.    

      This nearly 6 year old query may have found an answer via www.ebay.comitmItalian-Order-Medal-Opera-Nazionale-Per-LE-Citta-Dei-Ragazzi-Roma-Cased-Italy item 324112401347!  The second  and third figures below, the decoration bears a central medallion identical to the mystery object. 

      The listing identified it as an award of the Opera Nazionale per le Città dei Ragazzi, a Rome based organization.   Internet research established that the entity aims to provide assistance, social and professional education for children without valid family support and at risk of serious problems.  I emailed the organization to learn if it uses an award to recognize financial and other contributions.  The reply—maybe, sometimes.  Unfortunately no further information was forthcoming.  Presumably they have more emergent matters to hand now.   

      In any case, we may now have an identification for a mystery  medal!  
       

       

       

       

      post-260-0-04592300-1401343672.jpg

      s-l1600.jpg

      httpswww.ebay.comitmItalian-Order-Medal-Opera-Nazionale-Per-LE-Citta-Dei-Ragazzi-Roma-Cased-Italy324112401347ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055359.m1431.l2649.jpg

    8. Congratulations on assembling this group of rare decorations!  Thank you for posting these images and information.  The McKay collection at the Smithsonian Institution in Washington, D.C. U.S.A. contains a Grand Cross and a Grand Commander set of this Order.  I saw them in the early 1970's; the Grand Cross star had an inscription on the reverse but I cannot recall whether it related to the maker or to an individual.

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