demir

Dear Dave,

Thank you for the lovely introduction and the pictures of the IndependenceMedal.

This is the picture of obverse side.

The figures on this side are: OBVERSE

The first Parliament Building in Ankara under the rays of the sun. These raysrepresent the victory and the foundation and birth of the Turkish Republic

Ankara houses and mosque on both sides of the Parliament.

Under parliament symbol of earth and sickle and scythe,anvil and hammer,palette and brush represents the new Republic' commintment to science,agriculture, industry and culture and shows her aim to unite with heworld.

Oak leaves and clouds on both sides and 23 April 1336 (1920) (inaugurationdate of the Parliament)(1336 left). Under the clouds a peasant women leading anoxcart. (representing the independence war.) 23 April written in the oldscript. (Using Arabic letters)(This changed after the acceptence of the Latinalphabet in 1928)

Under the oxcart clouds and rays continues from above and inhe middle a plumb, representing the foundation of the state.

REVERSE:

Under the moon and the crescent (Turkish flag) the map ofthe Republic. A star representing the new Capital Ankara and 7 rays emergingfrom it, reaching the borders, Edirne on the west and Kars on the right. Withinthe upper border of the moon, there are olive leaves for peace and in themiddle, the date 1 November 1922 (1 Teşrinisani 1338 - abolition date of thesultanate).

This medal is to be worn on the right side, half under the collar.

Best wishes and thanks again.

demir :beer:

And these medals I can't recognize:

24. Unknown Medal

25. Unknown Medal and Badge (something Red Crescent (Kızılay) commemorative?)

Hi,

First Medal:

Yurtta Sulh, Cihanda Sulh : Famous motto of Ataturk (Peace at Home, Peace in the World)

I don't know why it is given, but it is made in the State Mint n Istanbul.

best wishes

Demir

Hello, gentlemen.

Just want to continue Turkish Republic theme:

(What name is correct for Nışani in modern Turkey - "Order" or "Honour Badge"?)

1. Devlet Nışani / Order of the State

2. Cumhurıyet Nışani / Order of the Republic

3. Lıyakat Nışani / Order of Merit

4. Devlet Şeref Madalyası / State Medal of Honour

5. Devlet ?v?n? Madalyası / ? (please give translation who knows)

6. Devlet ?st?n Hızmet Madalyası / State Medal for Distinguished Service

Hi,

Devlet Ovunc Madalyası: State Medal of Pride (To be proud of ...)

demir

Please als beware of

dominique.80

from istanbul

Dear Friends,

Please be aware of medals sold by certain sellers in the known website.

"dursen51" then " cinare2006 " from Germany is selling mainly Akka (d'acre) medal and a medallion of german,austria and ottoman rulers

Now " moys-10 " from Germany is selling the same medals. I believe they are all same.

Also in these days "abilge" is selling some Osmanie's from Australia, he also sells through Belgium. He also sells Mecidie orders but they are easy to understand becaus of the position of the stars on top the layer.

330345390999

330345593738

330345592667

330345596310 (imagine a red Osmanie)

Best wishes

Hi,

Now " cinare2006 " is selling "dursen51" s fake medals etc.

Also, fake Turkish commemorative coins are being sold by Hong Kong and Chinese people. They are selling silver coins as bi-metal colored coins. They were successful and get app. USD 450 for each coin. I wrote to ebay but as usual I got some automated replies .

Best wishes

demir

http://www.darphane.gov.tr/english/madeofoutside.htm

Hello,

" moys-10 " from Germany is also selling same medals of above mentioned sellers. Artikelnummer: 160344141528

Also selling a TWM :Canakkale Madalyası Eiserner Halbmond 160344136828

best wishes

demir

These sailors were not serving in Turkey, but had come from there.

The text is such a bad image I cannot read it. In natural color and larger, more would be possible:

"Zur Erinnerung am

...........zeit im

...........(jahr?) 1917

Divisionsschule

Kiel-Wik

Meiner ..... jetzt

.......................

.......................

............ Ich habe

gerade .............

...(tage?) .......

........................

Schreiben wenn

auch bekommen

..............Gr??e

euer ........."

So this was taken at the school in Kiel-Wik in 1917. Undoubtedly some of these sailors had served in Turkey earlier.

For a bunch of photos of Goeben taken at Stenia Dockyard and in the Bosporus and Black Sea, see:

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=18483&hl=B?ning

Hi,

Thank you very much.

Marvellous photos. Nice collection. It is reaaly interesting to see the original crew of the Goeben with Ottoman uniforms.

I recently bought this card written by a German.

Best wishes

demir

PICTURE 6 SOME PICTURES ABOUT WERFT DIVISION

Sailors of the Werft Divisions were used to guard naval bases and as marine infantry on board ships.

1.An NCO's cap from the I. Werft Division.

2.The other side of the Werft Division cap

3.The inside of the Werft Division cap showing the owner's name (Esser), unit number and date (1916)

PICTURE 5 BRESLAU (Midilli)

PICTURE 4 GOEBEN (YAVUZ)

Along with the battlecruiser Goeben, the light cruiser Breslau served in the German Mediterranean Sea Division at the outbreak of World War I. On 15 August 1914, the Goeben and Breslau (along with their crews) were formally transferred into the Turkish Navy and renamed Yavuz Sultan Selim and Midilli respectively. On 20 January 1918, the Goeben?Yavuz Sultan Selim and the Breslau?Midilli sortied into the Aegean Sea to attack British troop transports. Shortly after taking part in the sinking of the British monitors Raglan and M 28 off Imbros, the Breslau?Midilli struck five mines and sank with the loss of 331 Turkish and German members of her crew. The surviving 162 crewmembers were rescued by a British destroyer and became prisoners of war. The Goeben?Yavuz Sultan Selim also struck multiple mines during the same action and was run aground on her return voyage. Although exposed to heavy air attacks, she was finally freed from the sandbank six days later.

pıcture 3 LETTER BEHIND THE PHOTO

PICTURE 2 DETAIL

SAILOR WEARING THE TURKISH WAR MEDAL

Dear Friends,

I bought a picture recently about the German Sailors under the command of Werft Division I.A.L (what I can read from the picture) served in one of the two war ships battle cruiser Goeben (later YAVUZ) , the light cruiser Breslau (later MIDILLI).

Pictures will be shown below in other attachments.(because of the upload limit)

If anybody can read the letter behind the photo, written in 1917 please translate it for me.

I also included the some pictures about the Werft Division

Thanks

demir

PICTURE 1 Sailors of the Werft Division I.A.L 1917

Dear Terry,

Lovely certificate. You are lucky to find one like this.

I am sorry that we couldn't meet this time but I am sure that we will get together next year either in Turkey or England.

demir

Lovely bar. He also had TWM.

demir

Found one on Amazon, but $300+. Haven't checked ABE, but shall.

Hello,

When you find the book for USD 100 in ebay buy it. It is a heavy book around 3 kg. So the S/H will be high.

It is hard to find now.

Don't forget it is only Turkish.

If anybody is interested I can try to find in Ankara and inform the price.

Best wishes

demir

Very nice! Thanks, Demir (and Rick).

More information on the Edhem Eldem book, please?

Hello Ed,

The book was published on the occasion of the exhibition named Iftihar and Imtiyaz (Valor and Privilege) Ottoman Order and Medals organized by Turkish ministry of Culture and Garanti Bank between 28.9.2004-26.12.2005.

The name of the book is Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, Osmanlı nisan ve Madalyalar Tarihi by EDHEM ELDEM sold during the exhibition. price app. USD 80.00. 528 fine paper pages with a lot of pictures of the military personel wearing order and medals + all ottoman medals,orders,bars etc.

Best wishes

Demir

picture 4

book: Ottoman Medals and Orders Documented History by Metin Erureten

1. Canakkale (Gallipoli), 2. Caucasus

best wishes

Demir

picture 3:

Book: Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, History of Ottoman Order and Medals by Mr. Edhem Eldem

1st bar: Caucasus, 2nd bar: Sakarya (Turkish Independence war)

3,4,5 bars : Romania (Collection: Isa Akbas)

picture 2:

Book: Iftihar ve Imtiyaz, History of Ottoman Order and Medals by Mr. Edhem Eldem

from left 3rd ribbon bar : Palestine (Collection: Isa Akbas)

Gentlemen,

In order to help to understand the old Ottoman Turkish Script on the Turkish medal ribbon bars I am posting 4 different pictures of the ribbon bars.

Best wishes

Demir

Picture 1: Ottoman Medals and Orders Documented History by Metin Erureten

first row: 1. Gallipoli 2. Liyakat medal 1332 3. Suez Channel (Sinai)

second row: 1. Iraq 2. Caucausus 3. The Siege of Kut (was a major battle of World War I, now Iraq)

Which Ratzeburg?

Are those imperial navy buttons? The only one that shows clearly has your name slapped across it.

The campaign bar on his TWM ribbon over his EK2, if can be enlarged clearly, will provide some clues.

Too bad whatever the shoulder boards are are "off camera"--

navy buttons, army Wound Badge...

no name?

That style of facial fur was common with naval engineers and such technical types.

Gentlemen,

Why do you think it is TWM ribbon. This is a black and white photo, it could be easily Iron Cross ribbon, instead of red it might easily be black interior with with white borders.

And if it is Iraq bar (I am sure not Gallipoli/Canakkale) the ribbon is not TWM ribbon. Am I right?

all the best

demir

Which Ratzeburg?

Are those imperial navy buttons? The only one that shows clearly has your name slapped across it.

The campaign bar on his TWM ribbon over his EK2, if can be enlarged clearly, will provide some clues.

Too bad whatever the shoulder boards are are "off camera"--

navy buttons, army Wound Badge...

no name?

That style of facial fur was common with naval engineers and such technical types.

Gentlemen,

Why do you think it is TWM ribbon. This is a black and white photo, it could be easily Iron Cross ribbon, instead of red it might easily be black interior with with borders.

And if it is Iraq bar (I am sure not Gallipoli/Canakkale) the ribbon is not TWM ribbon. Am I right?

all the best

demir

This is the best I can do....

Hello,

I think it is Iraq.

Please see the picture from Mr. Er?reten's ottoman medals and Orders page 253.

They are:

1.Gallipoli 2. Liyakat medal 1332 3.Suez Channel (Sinai)

4.Iraq 5.Caucausus 6.Siege of Kut (was a major battle of WWI,now Iraq)

Best wishes

demir

Hello Demir,

You should pardon me but I have made a great confusion on the matter, now !

Unfortunately in the 2 photos I have of Gen. Manera wearing his awards, He clearly don't wear the Ottoman medal but only the Turkish, Order of Medjie at his neck.

I have understood that it can be of great help to you for correctly identify what was the Ottoman medal 'Sega Kat' General Manera received in 1908, to describe exactly what rank Manera had and what He did in the period 1899-1911 :

"""In 1899 Gen. Cosma Manera went to Crete as a Lieutenant of the 2? Battalion / 93? Infantry.

At the end of the 1904 He was sent in Macedonia, as member of the Italian Mission to organize a local police force. He came back to Italy from Macedonia on 5th August, 1908. He became Captain in 1911."""

My questions

1) Again, bearing in mind that till 1911 He was a Lieutenant, what is more probable that he received as Ottoman medal : the Liyakat medal or the IMTIYAZ MEDAL ?

2) If I have well understood there was a difference in awarding the two medals above mentioned, pending the rank held by the person at the time of the award, isn't it ?

If yes, what between the Liyakat medal and the IMTIYAZ MEDAL was the medal awarded to a person that held the rank of Lieutenant at the time of the award ?

3) Which is more probable that General Manera received : the Gold or the Silver issue ? (it is not specified in the papers).

I apologise if I ask you to repeat what is your thinking about the medal awarded to Manera but, as I already have told above, I made a great confusion.

Awaiting to hear from you again

Thanks for your patience

Best Regards

Lilo

Hi,

Sorry,

Above is the all I could say.

Best wishes

demir