Hauptmann

Hallo Dan,

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_04_2007/post-950-1175583904.jpghttp://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_04_2007/post-950-1175583916.jpg

I thought most, if not all Iron Crosses II Class, were constructed from two Iron Cores, a front and a back, these held together with the silver rim??

Kevin in Deva

Hi Kevin,

I'd never heard that before. Far as I know the core is a solid piece of iron... just as in the case of the one I have. It's held between the two silver frames which are silver soldered together. Again, that's the way I've always known it to be. Perhaps some of our experts on Iron Crosses can chime in here.

But I've no reason to believe this to be anything but authentic. I got it in a dealers junk box a couple decades ago. Probably paid a couple of bucks for it. It's identical in size to the cores in all the IC's I have and the details look correct. It's just definitely been there and done that.

Anyhow here's hoping we'll get some more comments coming in.

Thanks,

Dan

Very happy that I've finally been able to complete the set... it's taken me a long time.

Dan

Back of the nut:

Now for the family group which I've finally completed:

The one I just received is the gold ship badge which designates a Fleet Commander (Admiral). I already had the gold for the Sub and both the silver badges (ship and sub) as well.

Hi all,

I've had most of these for quite a number of years, but I just got a couple of new additions... one I'm not sure about... don't know if it's a fake or a variation so would love comments on it.

First off, the one I'm concerned about:

First the obverse. It seems a tiny bit smaller somehow than the others I have. Also the enamel in the star does not stand out quite as well as my others do:

Reverse... note the odd nut on the screwback... never seen one like this before:

Closeup of the star:

Hi all,

Well, I "finally" received the medal to go with my early Urkunde. Took over two weeks via parcel post to get from L.A. California to me here in Eastern North Dakota! The U.S. Snail strikes again!

I'd actually emailed with the seller several times and arranged for it to be sent Priority Mail with insurance and delivery confirmation/tracking. It was mentioned in several E's. However, the only time I neglected to mention it was on the card I sent with the Postal Money Order (God save me from folks who don't take Paypal! ) listing what he was to include in the shipment as well as both our addresses in case anything happened to the package label and it needed to be opened they could get it back on it's way to me.

Well, what does he go by... not the emails, not the fact that there's more money in the PMO than he asked for in the invoice... doesn't write an ask me about that... no, he just assumes it's to go regular mail. Arrrrrrgh!

Oh well, I'm just soooooo happy I got it and that I don't have to worry about it being lost in postal limbo anymore.

Anyhow, here are some additional views. The box has seen some better times but it's solid, has a nice inset base, good construction and it's only major problem in my eyes is that the little brass button that holds it closed is missing. The push button is there as is the spring mechanism... it's just the little catch that's gone.

A few things to note on this piece. One, both the medal and ribbon have the early type clasp which is proper for one of this time period. The ribbon is cloth but has a plastic cover over it. And the medal itself is a bit larger than it's later cousins.

So now it's home with it's document and it seems very happy and contented after it's long journey through the postal system.

Dan

Dan

And here are a couple more views of the Civil Defense medal bar:

Here's the Kampfgruppe badge. I'm quite pleased with this one.

Dan

Here's the reverse. Is that device on the bottom normal? If so, what is it for... ie: how does it attach on the uniform?

Dan

Hi all,

Well, some packages are finally arriving. Here are some additional views of my latest acquisitions.

First up, the Bester Badge. Was rather disappointed on this one. It appears to be the same badge that was pictured in the auction but how she got red enamel out of it I'll never know because here's what I received:

Compare that with it's picture from the seller below. Thank goodness it was cheap but now I'm back to looking for a better one. Although I will say I rather like that "camo" effect on the helmet.

And now...

Actually this looks tons better in person than in the scans. It's absolutely beautiful! A friend of mine did this for me. He removed the old silver paint someone put on it and then used his airbrush to repaint it black. Took him four tries to get it up to his standard. I just wish I could get it to show up as well with the scanner as it looks in daylight in front of me.

Dan

Hi all,

Here's my latest addition. Seems my luck is holding... a second DDR medal bar and with one of my all time favorite medals (the Verdienst medal on the left) on it to boot!

Just love this one!!!! Can't wait to see it in person.

Dan

Thanks Dan, for the clarification and the information on General Heinz Hoffmann

BTW it intresting to note that he died in the year of my birth

Order of Victory

Hi Vic,

Glad you liked the info. He seems to have had a long and fairly distinguished career. His ribbon bar is nothing to sneeze at either. And how ironic about him dying same year as you were born. Ever feel the urge to take the salute during parades? Perhaps there's some reincarnation going on here.

I'll see if I can scan another pic or two from my reference a bit later. Hoping to do some scanning anyhow depending on how things go today.

Dan

i just mooched around Ebay.de for the last two Dan , they seem to show up now and again .

Well, I must say... some very nice "mooching" indeed! Great finds!!!!

Dan

Dan,

I found some pictures last night from our Fireman's Museum visit that are worth posting. They are of medals and are dark but worth putting up. So they don't get lost in the welter, and title of a uniform, I am going to start a new thread that will just be for Firemen's medals. It can be added to be anyone then and perhaps we can build up a good resource for them that way. I picked up one Friday that will be my first actual medal post as soon as I get a chance to write it up.

Cheers,

Gordon

Hi Gordon,

Super! Looking forward to it!!!! And sounds like a very interesting thread.

Mucho thanks!

Dan

Dan,

There were a lot of cased awards but not of medals. There simply was not enough time to study all there was to see nor could I understand enough (any?) of the Hungarian to recognize what I was looking at. There was a wall of medals but because of its location my pictures of the medals did not turn out. All were blurry. Charles' camera has a better resolution than mine but both have the standard problem of digital cameras that the photo is often blurry. We need to take an least two pictures of everything and even then we do not always get the desired results. I have already posted pretty much all of the good photos I have of the time frame of this forum. Perhaps when Charles returns to the city he will have time to add some of his photos.

Indeed the flag is a beauty. Would love to one of that quality.

Regards,

Gordon

Hi Gordon,

Believe you me, I know the frustrations of digital cameras all too well as evidenced by some of my earliest posts. Perhaps on another trip they might let you pop inside the glass to get some good pics under their supervision. I know many museums will do this if you get with the right person in charge and show them how serious a collector/historian you are. I always go by the idea that "It never hurts to ask". By the sound of how they reacted to ya'll visiting this past time I think they're so starved for attention they'd be more than pleased to help ya'll to get better pictures. Who knows... you might end up driving home in an old Fire Truck to add to the collection!!!! Seems by the sound of it stranger things do happen over there.

Would love to see pics of the cased awards. I especially love that aspect of the munkasor group I got from Charles.

Amen on the flag!!!! An absolute beauty without a doubt!

Thanks again for all your and Charles efforts in all this.

Dan

Wow! Love those last two!!!!!!!! I sure wish I could find those for a good price... especially cased. Been on my list for quite some time. Great additions to the collection!!!! Me fears you may need an entire new house before all is said and done... don't think a new wing is gonna do it!

Dan

Can't wait to see more! Fantastic report so far. Yet again I'm tempted to leap on the plane (and I'm not fond of flying) and head over just to visit the museum... well, and the market of course!

Looked like some cased awards in front of the Generals display... am curious about those. You know me and cased stuff. Love the General's uniform and especially that rack of ribbons!!!! And that flag is BEAUTIFUL!!!! Very colorful.

Thanks so much to both you Gordon to to Charles for sharing your adventures, your knowledge, your time and your collections with us. You truly inspire us to learn more and to continue to build out collections. Couldn't do it without you!

Dan

Yes this the first time I have had time to look through the box properly, once again thank you

Vic

Hi Vic,

Glad you like the new goodies. I would mention a couple of things though. The swallows nests are pairs. But I know it's easier to just picture one each as they're kinda on the big side of things. Also, I can't take but a little credit for the silver medal and urkunde... I just pointed you in the right direction on those. But it's a great set! I wonder if that's an original signature... I think it's General Heinz Hoffmann... here's a good bio on him:

http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=5973

And the only pic I could find on the web:

Key Warsaw Pact figures. From right; East German Defence Minister Heinz Hoffmann, Polish Premier Wojciech Jaruzelski, Warsaw Pact Commander in Chief Viktor Kulikov, and Czechoslovakian Defence Minister Martin Dz?r discussing Warsaw Pact manoeuvres in Poland, March 1981.

Parallel History Project on NATO and the Warsaw Pact, www.isn.ethz.ch/php, by permission of the Center for Security Studies at ETH Zurich and the National Security Archive at the George Washington University on behalf of the PHP network.

This image has information on its source, however it does not have information on its copyright status. It may be usable under fair use but this has yet to be verified. It might be public domain or under a licence compatible with the GNU FDL. To the uploader: Please provide licensing information as soon as possible. Images without this information may be deleted in the future.

And a short article on his death in 1985:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html...751C1A963948260

Dan

Hi Vic,

Glad I could help out my friend. Hopefully more coming before long.

Dan

Hi all,

I used to deal with a guy in Florida who was into DDR. He'd served in army intelligence over in Germany and knew quite a bit about the DDR and had been there several times. The DDR required all young men and women reaching a given age (can't remember but think it was like 17 for the guys and 18 for the women or something like that) had to serve at least a minimum term in the military (I think a year). This seems to be what several if not all of the Warsaw Pact countries did. My understanding from him was that most did not want to serve, did so begrudgingly and could not wait to get out. So they'd put in their minimum time, most being miserable while serving and high tail it out asap when their time was up. Therefore the vast majority didn't have any medals and awards to speak of. It tended to be the long serving NCO's, Warrant Officers and Officers who got a bunch of stuff. Even among the officers most seem to have only a medal or two. You can see this in the last DDR parade video... most have nothing or perhaps an academy badge, NVA sports badge, shooting cord but that's about it. Only a few have awards beyond that and only a very few seemed to have a sizeable rack of medals and other awards.

So my guess is that ID books with awards listed will be few and far between, and those with a bunch of awards... well, if you find em' ya better grab em'!

Hope this helps,

Dan

Thanks to Ehrentitle :

I grade class for sea going personnel

Hi Grant,

Congratulations on completing the set!!!! Onward, ever onward!

Dan

You two are NOT alone. Just what I need!

Well Ed... I can't imagine we could be in better company.

Dan

I must say the Yugo section has given me an incentive to buy more Yugo pieces, oh my poor bank account

Order of Victory

Hi Vic,

Amen for you and me both my friend!!!!

Dan

Very well said Dan. Books are the key.... and as much hands on experience as one can possibly get! Like you back in the early 90's, collecting soviet was almost blind till the advent of the red bible. It only started to get better years after that.

As for lansknecthe's comment.... well.... in this particular case anyone involved in selling or buying is disturbing as how such an item can ever be considered authentic and original is way beyond me!

Jim

Many thanks Jim! And amen to lansknechte's comments as well. And on the Soviet items and still to a very large extent the rest of the Soviet Block countries which save for GMIC there is very little reference material available, especially in English. Thank God for the red and green bibles and Dave's additional contribution there (which I still have to order, but for the most part I, like many others I'm sure was flying blind for years. If only I'd known then what I know now there are so many high end pieces I'd have grabbed. Sigh. Now they're out of reach for the most part or in some cases will just cost me dearly... but who knew. I mean I had no idea what 98% of the Orders and medals were much less what they were called or what to pay for them if I ran across them. First ORS I ever saw was in a small shop I used to frequent (which is long gone) and was on consignment. Was asking $350! I passed as I simply didn't have the funds at the time. And the guy wasn't open to trade... only cash. Now who knows... might have been a rare type or something. Had no idea of such things back them much less researching or any of the rest. That all came a good bit after that. But when ORS's started going for $15 to $35 not too long after that... well I felt very happy that I'd passed on that first one.

On the other Soviet Block countries I just look for what I feel are deals I simply can't pass up for items I like and I grab them. Over time you get a feel for things but boy oh boy would some good references in English make all the difference.

All we can do, both as a club and as collectors is to educate new collectors whenever we have a chance and teach them to read, study and check out other collections, museum displays, etc., every chance they get so it will better prepare them for the moment when they face some copies or mucked up garbage like that ribbon bar... and they can "Just say no!."

Thanks,

Dan