Hauptmann

Hi all,

Beauties, one and all!!!! And special thanks to Paul for getting it all started!

Keep em' coming... want to see more!

Dan

Dan. Not just Patton but everyone seemed to hate the Soviets, except my Grandfather. He hated the Czar and church! I wish I could have known him. It will be interested to find out my families wartime information. I do know that my GreatAunt was a partisan and was killed by the Germans. One of her sons survived and became a Soviet Pilot in the 1950's.

Hi Paul,

It's just that Patton seemed to revel in his hate of them. I've heard from alot of Russians that they hated the Czar but not really the church before. Even alot of the Soviets seemed to secretly continue to believe even when it was officially not the thing to do.

I've studied the last Czar and his family and just can't share their opinion of him. I really felt for him... all of them. He was, by his own admission not really suited to nor had his father trained him to be Czar. His father of course had died young and unexpectedly and it left Nicholas holding the bag. Perhaps his greatest fault was that he did not abdicate in favor of his brother Michael... who may or may not have made a better Czar. Nicholas tended to be too much of a gentle family man who was thrust into the position of running the country and floundered in it much of the time.

I've heard he was an alcoholic, but only once and have never read such in any of the biographical or historical texts I've ever read.

Circumstances were also very much against him... not unlike Carter when he was president. The )$*@$+T&#$ hit the fan, the fan was on high and he was simply not the man for the job at that time and place. In another time perhaps but not then. Hence he tends to be remembered as being a bad president. I don't think he was in all ways. He honestly tried as I feel Nicholas did at being Czar. But he got hit with revolutionaries left and right, troubles in the Balkans, like there was ever a time when there wasn't trouble in the Balkans, family problems including his only sons hemophilia, Rasputin, who certainly seemed to be in "exactly" the right time and place to cause the maximum of trouble, and WWI.

The "one" major thing I have always hated about the communists and Lenin in particular is that they killed Nicholas and his family. Had they simply sent them into exile in England or elsewhere I honestly think that much of the animosity towards them would never have occured. They created their own bad press with that more than much of what they did in the beginning. Then of course killing people in massive amounts equal to or most likely far exceeding the nazi's did not help at all... and much of that was of course under Stalin.

History is bloody... sad but true. We're reminded of that all the time.

But it sounds like you have a great family history. Very sorry to hear about your Great Aunt... may she rest in peace. A very brave woman I'm sure. And that's one thing I, and many others I'm sure admire so much about the Russian people. They do not lack bravery or a fighting spirit. They do whatever it takes to defend their motherland and you've got to admire that no matter what.

When it came right down to it, I know that the vast majority of Russians who fought during the war did so not out love for Stalin or the party... more fear in that regard... but because they were fighting for Mother Russia and their families and loved ones. A great people for sure!

And then a pilot in the 50's... more interesting times. Did he end up being one of those who flew in Korea? Any idea what he flew? Bombers, fighters? How about awards... did he or his mother receive any? Of course over there they gave so many for just about anything I guess it would be the rare person who never got anything. They probably had an award for pushing more paper than anyone else! LOL! But always fascinated to hear what people were given for what they did and why they got it.

I only wish more histories would become available in English. I'd love to see a complete history of each awards recipients as that would be great reading... although I'm sure quite tragic and sad considering how many ended up being persecuted, sent to gulags or shot outright. What a waste so much of it was.

So how did you get interested in Patton? He's always been one of the biggies on my radar, along with Rommel and Zhukov, at least as far as WWII is concerned.

On the book I'm now up to the Order of Alexander Nevsky. Great reading!

Thanks,

Dan

OK You have convinced me. I will buy a copy. I am new to Soviet awards but an education is always the first step. I also want to be able to evaluate what awards my relative in the Ukraine have.

Hi Paul,

I would expect no less from a Patton fan... even though he hated the Russians! Believe me when I say it's "well" worth it!!!! I'm only up to the Order Of The October Revolution and now that for a fact. And when you pick it up it even feels like something that is worth what it costs!

And look at it this way... if you "ever" want to resell it.. you won't lose any money... just about flat out guaranteed from what I've seen... unless you want to use it to grease the treads of your tank... so that probably would not be advisable if you'd want to get the full value out of it.

Seriously though, it's just a flat out great book and I think anyone who has even the "slightest" interest in Soviet history or their awards will enjoy it for many years to come.

Let us know what you think what you get your copy and start reading it.

Dan

I see the shipping went more smoothly for your McDaniel book Dan!

I will be keeping my eyes peeled for any good research book on Soviet and TR items myself, and I wish they were easier to come by!

A wonderful trade wouldn't you say Dan (your old friends are safe and sound and in good company) and now you finally have the "bible".

Cheers,

Pat

Hi Pat,

Definitely... other than a little bit more of a wait it went very smooth... UPS must have been doing penance. As it was, the end of this past week I sent out a shipment to my mom out in California, overnight via Fedex. Knew it wouldn't be delivered until Monday as it was a good deal more for Saturday delivery and it was something she had to have on time. And what happens? The driver had filled out the form, copying it from past receipts. He screwed up (was a different driver than normal as well) and forgot to put south in part of her address. Hence it didn't get delivered on Monday. So much for the best laid plans of mice, men and me!

And now... believe it or not I need to send a small package with one item out to New Zealand. I can't believe I'm jumping right in... but from what I understand Canada is one of, if not "the" worst place to ship stuff to due to all the read tape and gov't nonsense. Hoping NZ won't be a problem.

As far as German refs you have my recommendations on those... and I'm sure most anyone would agree with them. On the Soviet... I have one... McDaniel & Schmitt, hands down, without a doubt. That is if you're going to be serious about it. If you're only going to casually collect them I'd still recommend it but there are others which will give you the basics... and I think I've already passed on recommendations on those. If not give me a nudge and I'll be happy to do so.

Very glad that all my old friends are safe and sound in a new loving home. Again can't wait to see pics of them in their new environment.

And yes, LOVE my red bible!!!! I know it's the best investment I've ever made in my Soviet collection... without a doubt! Again, highly recommend you get one first chance you get... you may never want to put it back down!

Dan

Welcome to the "club"!

There are other Soviet awards books out there, but I don't think that any of them come close to the level of detail or quality of production as the Comprehensive Guide. However, ironically some sell for more though!

Unfortunately, no one has yet to convince PMD (and I've tried) to put out a "second, revised edition." I personally think that he'd make a killing off of it, but no luck...yet...

Dave

Hi Dave,

Many thanks! I did see that they are putting out a companion volume on researching Soviet awards... I just wish they'd give some idea of the price range as if I make this next set of sales of my TR stuff I'm going to "have" to set enough aide. No more waiting nine years to get a copy!

And yes, it would be great if they'd put out a revised 2nd... but I only hope they hang on long enough for me to recover from buying this one!

I'm now up to the section on the Order of Lenin. Did a bit of reading in that section when I first got up... but then had tons of stuff that I "had" to do around the house and now work is looming on the horizon. But with luck I'll get through more of it today. So far... fantastic!

I do have a question though, which may even be addressed in the book but figured I'd ask. Does anyone have any idea why the time on the Spasky Tower pictured on several Soviet awards is always set to that same hour? Was it just a random choice or is there some deep significance to it?

Thanks!

Dan

Congratulations on the new arrival! Like any other book, not perfect, but darn nice. Try to find time to get some sleep in between your power-lifting exercises with this wonder.

It will indeed be a sad day when the (probably close) moment arrives when these are no longer to be had.

Hi Ed,

Many thanks! Not sure on sleep... I've been told I can sleep when I'm dead... but the reading I need to do now!

Well, I've finally cracked the covers... am up to the Acknowledgements. I figure I'm going to read this from cover to cover and squeeze everything out of it it has to offer.

Thanks,

Dan

Congrats on your book! I remember getting mine in 2000! It is the best book I have ever seen before or since!

Thanks Paul. I just finished dinner... waiting for tonights first ep of Combat! to end and then I'll pop in another tape and then I'm off to spend the evening with "the book". Hope Kim doesn't get too jeolous!

Dan

Nice purchase, you won't regret it! And for the record, I think this is THE best reference book I have come across for medals full stop. What makes it so nice to dip into is its accessiblity and a lightness of tone - I particularly like the bit where they have a rarity rating for the Order Of Victory - "you'll be lucky"!

McDaniel's site seems to be dormant but due to the proliferation of certificates on collectrussia etc he is still keeping that side of the business going?

Gilbert

Hi Gilbert,

Many thanks for the kinds words. I've had a bit more work pile up along with a few things on here that I had to take care of... pushed me back in my schedule a bit. Going to go rustle up some grub and once that's out of the way then I'm going to dive in and probably not come up for air for several days if I can avoid it... other than work.

And don't think I'd ever manage to be quite that lucky... to be able to get an OOV! I'd be lucky to get a good copy at some point.

This has been great though. Ever since I posted earlier I've felt like I've been having a party with ya'll stopping by to have a sip of champaign and join in the celebration. This is just a terrific place and ya'll are the best members a club could hope to have! My hat is off to each and every one of you!

Thanks!

Dan

This is the best book about Soviet Awards that has ever been published in English.

Yours to discover

Many thanks! Hoping to dive in in about another fifteen minutes when I'm done with work for the day.

Thanks!

Dan

I remember the day in '97 when it came out and Igor called me up to TELL me to get one...

(the closest reaction I can approximate to was for those of you old enough to remember the opening day first showing of the original "Star Wars" movie in 1977)

At some point, the unsold copies are going to disappear at long last, and this will be in the "rare out of print book" category.

Anyone who does not have one, should get one.

Hi Rick,

I'm definitely old enough and know "exactly" what you mean! Both definitely red letter days (no pun intended... well, maybe just a little one! ).

And I also totally agree... in fact they're getting tough to find now. This past fall when I made some sales and thought I could go ahead and order it (before life got in the way! ) I had searched the web, Amazon, Ebay, sites where it had been sold... but no more. I even went so far as to contact Paul McDaniel from his site and he wrote back and said even he didn't have copies for sale now.

I finally lucked into it over at collectrussia.com (Atlantic Crossroads, Inc.) where they still have them... till they run out that is. And at the issue price and $5 shipping via UPS, or $8 via USPS. I'd actually ordered it last week and have been pacing a trench in my floor ever since waiting for it's arrival. I only wish I could buy a few more and set them aside for that future day when they'll be worth their weight in gold... and with this book that will end up being quite a lot of gold!

And I promise Rick... the Epson scanner is now on the top of the "gotta get it" list!

Thanks!

Dan

Alfred ... I swear I havent been drinking, but is the pic upside down on your copy

I think it's just a super rare variation 2!

Dan

Great Dan,

Hi Alfred,

That MADE MY DAY!!!! I LOVE IT!!!!

Hey, a rare variation!!!!

Dan

Congrats,

Order of Victory

Many thanks! It's definitely a day of Victory!!!! Perhaps I should design a new award for the occassion! Of course then they'd "have" to put out another edition!

Dan

Dan,

I'm glad that you finally got one. You will find it to be most useful. Enjoy!!!

Doc

Hi Doc,

Many thanks! Definitely looks even better than all the pics I've seen... well worth the wait, all the pacing and fretting and knashing of teeth!

Hey, as an aside... the "eaglettes" have landed. I need to get with you and send over some pics of goodies for you to choose from. And the Belgian one should be here later this week.

Thanks so much for everything!!!!

Dan

Cool .... Not too many days go by I'm not browsing in its depths.

Hi Darrell,

I've got to agree... "depths" is definitely an appropriate word to use... it's definitely a thick and heavy one! But that's the way I like them... all the more to look through again and again.

Thanks!

Dan

Hi all,

I hope it's okay, me putting this here but I just had to share the news. After selling a few of my extra's and after a loooooooong wait, and after feeling I was the only person on the face of the planet who collected Soviet awards and didn't have it... I finally managed to purchase a new copy of McDaniel and Schmitt's book on Soviet Orders and Medals.

And the best part of all... it arrived today!!!!

Haven't been able to so much as crack the covers on it yet... been too busy with work and various other things. But I'm about at the point of being able to dive in and start devouring it.

It's much thicker than I imaged and just by the look of it it's well worth the price. I can't wait to start studying it.

I know to alot of you who have had it for a while it's probably not a big deal. But to me, on this day and at this time this is cause for celebration. I'm half tempted to run up and buy a bottle of champaign I'm so excited! It's just been so long in coming... was beginning to doubt it would ever happen.

I'm so glad I was finally able to get this and I just know it's going to help me in my Soviet collecting well beyond it's price.

I know alot of you have probably been keeping your fingers crossed that I'd manage to get this and for that I am deeply grateful.

Now... the next item on the agenda... that Epson scanner! All good things come to those who wait.

Thanks!

Dan

Well Dan, not sure what they would be worth as a set. They are definitely two different makers and the doc doesn't specify which grade is awarded. I am an IAB collecter almost exclusively so my answer would tend to ramble on and on as alot of fellow members know........

Anyway the SHuCo is a common maker in general but there are variants that are more rare or desirable.....steel examples, semihollow zincers, hollow marked and unmarked zincers.....so one of those would command more. The bronze JFS is also common but they usually keep their finish very nicely making them desirable. Then there is the question of the history behind this framed group????? So it really is hard to say.....as a collection of its parts then anywhere from 120-200 for the JFS and 90-150 for the SHuCo and the doc I'm kind of ignorant on but I havenever paid more then 30 for a doc. These are just ranges I have seen or paid myself.

Hi Greg,

Never fear rambling on with me... I tend to be a bit of a rambler as many can attest.

I really wish there was a way to check it out without messing up the framed display. What I may do is check with a frame shop the next time I've over near one and see what they'd recommend. If it's not much for them to pop new paper over the old, and if they can reglue the original frame companies label on the new paper then I wouldn't mind opening it up as I'm fairly sure seeing the backs would not be difficult at that point.

It's been soooooo long since I got this set but I'm sure I have less in the entire thing than what you quote for low end on either of the badges. I don't know why I didn't think to ask Jack about makers at the time and there's no guarantee he'd have remembered... although he might have had it noted down somewhere.

But this definitely gives me an idea and that's basically all I needed for those. Hopefully if I can manage to get good scans, or if I get it opened can take some better pics of them then perhaps we can nail it down a bit more.

I really appreciate your help on this. And again, please feel free to ramble on with me anytime... even if you need to PM to do it. Always up for a good long chat.

Many thanks!

Dan

Hi Dan, it is safe to say that the most likely maker of the bronze IAB is JFS, if not RSS but certainly one of the two. The silver is tougher to make out........if I had to guess I would say maybe SHuCo but definitely need a sharper pic to be certainon the silver. Bronze 99% sure its JFS.

Also, I will try to get better scans of it all once I "finally" manage to get my Epson scanner.

Dan

Hi Dan, it is safe to say that the most likely maker of the bronze IAB is JFS, if not RSS but certainly one of the two. The silver is tougher to make out........if I had to guess I would say maybe SHuCo but definitely need a sharper pic to be certainon the silver. Bronze 99% sure its JFS.

Hi Greg,

No plan to let these go right now but just out of curiosity, of course depending on the maker, what these would be worth, especially as a set as I'd never want to split them up.

I am sadly contemplating letting a few more of my TR pieces go. Am very torn, especially as the major one would be my GPB from Jack. Basically I have that, the set of IAB's and my navy dagger that were all from him. I definitely don't want to let loose any of them but from what I understand the GPB would give me a big boost in what I'm trying to buy.

Am also considering my Aux Cruiser and cased Blockade Runner set. Very hard thing to do. I quite understand how Grant felt re: his 57's collection. Not easy to let the little ones leave the nest, especially after so long.

Thanks,

Dan

Hi all,

Someone PM'd me suggesting someone who might be intro'd in badges like my Aux. Cruiser which were missing a clasp, etc, should I ever decide to part with any. I cannot find it in my PM's... may have accidently deleted it.

Am indeed considering letting go of my Aux. Cruiser, cased Blockade Runner and possibly my GPB. But of course the Aux. Cruiser does have the missing clasp, hence my need to get that info again. But of course if anyone else is intro'd in any of these please don't hesitate to PM me and let me know.

Many thanks,

Dan

Nice flags gentlemen. I was wondering if any of them were ww2 issue or earlier? The naval flags are especially nice and the finials are quite nice as well.

Later,

Pat

Hi Pat,

Many thanks! And as far as mine go... I don't believe so. I believe all of mine are say 60's to 90 period.

Thanks,

Dan

Hi all,

Here's my latest acquisition... just won on Ebay tonight so will probably be the middle or end of next week before I see it in person. Needless to say this is the sellers pic. I'll have to redo a few of these once this one gets here. Am hoping to manage to get a few poles to mount them on with their finials before too long. Once I do I'll snap some photos of them like that as well.

Without further ado:

[attachmentid=41939]

I just love the Order of the Red Banner of Labor pictured on the flag. I'm hoping it's the same on both sides. I saw this a bit ago and no one bid. Didn't have the money at the time. But managed to scrounge up enough this time and think I did good. Only $15.50 plus $5 shipping.

Not sure what it was from... perhaps some factory or something. But I really think it's a beautiful flag for sure... and not one I've seen all over like some of the naval flags on Ebay.

Thanks for stopping by to take a peek.

Dan

Hauptmann,

I was on the staff of Kaiserzeit from 1972 unitl it died. I was a great run and about the only place you could get any information on imperial German militaria at the time. The downfall was the last printer, who seemed to decide that he would just keep the subscription money and not send anything out. He had the gall to ask people to send more money after getting only one issue for the previous years $15.00 payment. Finally, everyone got tired of waiting and sending money and just threw in the towel. Kaiserzeit lasted for over ten years, which is a long time for a publication that was put together with articles by unpaid enthusiasts. I still have a complete set of the journal.

Chip

Hi Chip,

I'm very sorry to hear all that. I only wish I'd known as my wife and I were in the publishing field and worked with printers all the time. Of course that was a bit before the desktop publishing of the last fifteen or so years with it getting better and easier all the time. But had we been able to do anything we would have been happy to.

But I do remember, now that you mention it, the endless waiting for more issues for my membership fee only to have them not come. The few that did were extremely interesting and I still have them somewhere in all my stuff, although I could not lay my hands on them right off the bat. It's a shame as I really thought it was a terrific idea at the time.

I also used to get Der Gauleiter... both when it was an auction and sellers and then when it went to auctions only. Finally it sold to someone, don't know who, and it then also seemed to peter out. The one thing I deeply regret in all that time is not being able to get the book of cartoons of "Orders and medals that should have been but weren't". Some of them were sooooo funny and I would have loved a complete collection.

Sigh... the good old days, gone forever.

Definitely good times while they lasted though and I guess nothing lasts forever.

Thanks for the trip down memory lane.

Dan

Daniel,

Sure, I have two of the Segeltuchtasche, one the M1915s (converted to M1916) and a M1916. Over the years I have had about five of them, even one in redbrown canvas. I wrote the first article printed about them, which appeared in Kaiserzeit in 1982 and was reprinted in the Phoenix Exchange a few years later. The article is now visible on Johan Somers' "Before 1919" website. Of course, much more information has been uncovered since then and is available in Kraus's 1999 books "Die Feldgraue Uniformierung des deutschen Heeres 1907-1918" (though he did pinch at least one bit of information from my article). I also have a Atemeinsatztasche M17.

Chip

Hi Chip,

Many thanks on the GM info. Quick question though... whatever happened to the Kaiserzeit, not to mention the Imperial German Military Collectors Association? I was a member... had received the KZ and then suddenly it was like they dropped off the face of the planet.

Do they still exist and if so how do I get back in? I've even still got my original membership card and number info.

Thanks,

Dan

Hi all,

Out of curiosity, roughly what would one of the Imperial German gasmasks, complete with cannister run nowadays? I have a WWII which I was told was likely issued to the Luftschutz and another WWII mask that I picked up a gazillion years ago for $10 in a surplus store in Clearwater Florida. It's nazi marked but was so dirty sitting on their shelf the only thing I knew was it was German and looked to be WWII. They didn't have the original cannister... just a West German which I got for $5 if I remember correctly.

But I'm curious about these Imperial issues. Our local history museum has one brought back by one of our local vets. And a friend of mine up here had one a few years ago that she sold before we moved up... a complete set. She said it was just like the one in the museum. She hated to tell me but I figure one will turn up eventually and it's nothing I'm in a hurry for. In fact my son is more into gas masks than I am. They're a nice addition to general field gear but nothing I'm actively seeking at the moment.

Thanks,

Dan