Mystery knife

[sptregalia]

[attachmentid=60902]

Does anyone know what this is?

This came in with a Knight's kit, but is that a red herring?

Is it a Knight's firing knife? If so, why has it got an anchor on the cross-guard?

It has an eagle with folded wings on the pommel. Hilt is probably brass. Blade is chromium-plated with SS stamped on it and a small area of sort of 'cross-hatching'. Overall length 8.25".

[coastie]

Perhaps it is a red herring, given the length it could just be a letter opener.

[peter monahan]

Perhaps it is a red herring, given the length it could just be a letter opener.

It has "fraternal order" written all over it! (In VERY tiny type ) Not Knights of Columbus - they use a helmet finial on their swords, but possibly Masonic or some other order of "knights'. Probably though, as Coastie says, a letter opener or decorator item owned by a member of one of the orders, as I've never seen/heard of daggers to go with the swords in thses orders.

my tuppence worth

Peter

[Humber]

Maybe?-- this is the description of their sword

Ancient Order of United Workmen (AOUW) The AOUW was founded in 1868 as a fraternal beneficiary society. It was dissolved in 1952 but some remnants of the order were active up until 1989.

Cruciform hilt, crapping eagle pommel, AOUW on blade and scabbard, skeletal hand on scabbard

Symbology and lettering:

Anchor

Skeletel Hand

Bible

"AOUW" lettering

[Kev in Deva]

[attachmentid=60902]

Does anyone know what this is?

This came in with a Knight's kit, but is that a red herring?

Is it a Knight's firing knife? If so, why has it got an anchor on the cross-guard?

It has an eagle with folded wings on the pommel. Hilt is probably brass. Blade is chromium-plated with SS stamped on it and a small area of sort of 'cross-hatching'. Overall length 8.25".

Hallo sptregalia

Is it possible to post some better pictures / scans of the detail on both sides of the knife handle / grip??

Kevin in Deva

[Humber]

These look very similar to your Picture albeit they appear of finer quality

here

There are also some in the 'German Swords & Daggers' section of this forum

Edited November 16, 2006 by Humber

[Kev in Deva]

These look very similar to your Picture albeit they appear of finer quality

here

There are also some in the 'German Swords & Daggers' section of this forum

Hallo Gents

The one listed under NVL12 - 049 - EARLY 2ND MODEL NAVAL - E. & F. H?rster.

http://www.wwiidaggers.com/17172.htm

or under Minitures, MINI - 023 - TRANSITIONAL HALF SIZE NAVAL - No Maker

http://www.wwiidaggers.com/22891.htm

looks remarkably similar to the one posted, at the start of the thread.

Sword & Dagger Firm represantatives carried with them mini versions of the daggers the firm had for sale as samples, I believe later the small sizes versions were sold as letter openers.

After looking at the first picture I thought of this as a sample but the picture was to small to say wether from Germany, Austria, or Bulgaria, Hungary, or even Romania, that why I asked the original poster for better pictures of the handle and cross-guard.

Kevin in Deva

Edited November 16, 2006 by Kev in Deva

[sptregalia]

Sorry not to have replied.My fingers aren't clever enough.

The Cross piece is the same both sides.The rear view of the Eagle is what you would expect.

To compare it with a Nazi dagger, is a flight of fancy.

I have a Nazi army officers dagger on Ebay at the moment ,140053179487. It's chalk and cheese.

The mystery knife is probably chrome plated iron.

I know K.T. Knights fire salutes with something like that which is pictured. Maybe in the same way that we use a firing glass. But I think it has other connections.

Happy to meet

Alan S

[Kev in Deva]

Sorry not to have replied.My fingers aren't clever enough.

The Cross piece is the same both sides The rear view of the Eagle is what you would expect

To compare it with a Nazi dagger, is a flight of fancy.

I have a Nazi army officers dagger on Ebay at the moment ,140053179487. It's chalk and cheese.

The mystery knife is probably chrome plated iron.

I know K.T. Knights fire salutes with something like that which is pictured. Maybe in the same way that we use a firing glass. But I think it has other connections.

Happy to meet

Alan S

Hallo Alan, Its not a comparason as such with TR, just trying to figure out what was used as a model for it..The rear view of the Eagle is what you would expect., which is????

Thats why I asked you to post some close-ups too help, but if thats to difficult. . . .

Kevin in Deva.

[Humber]

I'm not dismissing your KT theory, but The KT 'firing' you refer to are usually only about 3ins in length, others smaller fitting into a scabbard on a tie pin. All that I have seen are quite ornate and of a high quality. Also I have never seen these emblems within KT, but there are many 'knight' fraternities and it could be one of those, again I would expect the quality to be high and ornate, especially the blade.

[sptregalia]

Hallo Alan, Its not a comparason as such with TR, just trying to figure out what was used as a model for it..The rear view of the Eagle is what you would expect., which is????

Thats why I asked you to post some close-ups too help, but if thats to difficult. . . .

Kevin in Deva.

[sptregalia]

Just folded down wings.

Alan S

[sptregalia]

Yes it is very similar to item 2 ,22891.

It appears to be a paper knife version of the above.

It never had a swastika,but a de-natzified wreath is in the eagles tallons.

The hilt is one casting in base metal,plated.But identical in appearance to the illustration.

The Anchor is the same.

The blade is Chrome plated base metal.With SS stamped on it.

Wittmans book refers to the illustrated copy being---Tranisitional half size Nava

Now.How to turn it into money

Alan S l