Kriegsmarine Silver u-clasp citation

[Richard Sysum]

Hello Everyone

This a silver u-boat clasp citation to a man that served on U427.I have a few questions maybe someone can help.

1.When it says Bergen was this the place where the award was given to the man or where the citation was issued?

2What does gez mean where it says gez Kuhnke the strange thing is that Kuhnke was a Kor.Kpt and not a Kapt.z.see?

3.The stamp says hoheres Kommando de Unterseeboots Ausbildung I thought it may have been stamped by a combat flott or Norwegen headquarter stamp.As the man had been with the 13 and 14 flott for the last 4 months

Best Regards Richard..

Edited September 3, 2005 by Richard

[Simon Orchard]

Hello Everyone

This a silver u-boat clasp citation to a man that served on U427.I have a few questions maybe someone can help.

1.When it says Bergen was this the place where the award was given to the man or where the citation was issued?

2What does gez mean where it says gez Kuhnke the strange thing is that Kuhnke was a Kor.Kpt and not a Kapt.z.see?

3.The stamp says hoheres Kommando de Unterseeboots Ausbildung I thought it may have been stamped by a combat flott or Norwegen headquarter stamp.As the man had been with the 13 and 14 flott for the last 4 months

Best Regards Richard..

←

Wrong stamp

wrong base

wrong commander

wrong rank

Don't even like the way the date's written.

Is there more to this man?

[Gordon Williamson]

At the time this document is dated, Kuhnke was commander of 33 U-Flotille based in Flensburg with some boats also operating from bases in Jakarta in the Far East. Kuhnke was not in Bergen so I don't see how he could be referred to in a document issued there.

[Richard Sysum]

Hello

Here is the award page from his soldbuch.The award of the silver u-boat clasp is signed by OL Graf Karl Gabriel von Gudenus Kmdt of U427...

Regards Richard

[Richard Sysum]

Hello

Here is the Bronze u-boat clasp citation...

Regards Richard

PS I also have his u-boat citation and EK1 citation.

[Simon Orchard]

Hmmm, i don't like that silver clasp doc one little bit. None of it makes the slightest sense.

U-427 was in Narvik at the end of the war and belonged to the 14 fl. there.

Bergen, Kuhnke and the stamp are completely unrelated to the boat in question and to each other.

The SB clearly shows a date of the 11th May, not the 2nd or II, which is quite possible for Narvik given the situation there at the war's end. Also, given the date of the award any location for it's issuence other than Narvik or the surrounding area is impossible.

It'd be interesting to see the other docs.

Edited September 5, 2005 by Simon Orchard

[Richard Sysum]

Hello

Here is the EK1 citation.

[Richard Sysum]

Hello

Here is the u-boat citation...

[Simon Orchard]

Well those look ok.

[Richard Sysum]

Hello Everyone

I have now had a very very close look at all of the documents and soldbuch and I think that the soldbuch,u-boat citation,EK1 citation and bronze u-boat front clasp citation are all original.Someone has lifted the stamp from the bronze u-boat citation and printed it on the silver citation with a computer and printer then added all the other bits with a typewriter or something like that.

Can anybody estimate what the set would be worth without the silver u-boat clasp citation.I would estimate this...

u-boat citation ?250-300

EK1 citation ?200

u-boat front clasp citation ?375-450

soldbuch ?600

What do you think am I about right.I want to estimate that with the loss of the silver clasp clasp that I have not lost to much

Best Regards Richard

[Gordon Williamson]

Hi Richard,

You are in the right ballpark price wise. Maybe a little high on the EK1. For a D?nitz doc yes, but R?sing docs not quite so desirable. A lot would depend on the overall condition of the rest of the Soldbuch (whats the photo like).

Depending on condition of the Soldbuch, I'd be thinking anywhere between ?1250 - ?1400 on the set without the silver Spoange Doc ( which to be honest wouldn't add a huge amount anyway being a "field issue" doc just typed on a piece of paper)

[Richard Sysum]

Hello Gordon

The soldbuch is well filled in with leave signed by commander of u-boat e.t.c and it also complete with every page it is a little dog eared on the cover but it is 65 years old..I payed a bit more than ?1400 but not a lot more so I am not to unhappy.

Best Regards Richard.