EK 1939 L/56 EKII for consideration...

[robert pierce]

I hope this photo turns out OK. Now, from my understanding, here are two 2nd generation frames - W&L on the left, and Juncker on the right. I'll say this also; I don't know how many times Juncker 'reworked' their dies. Making new dies doesn't make sense at all. Instead, 'I think' (presume) Juncker used the same dies over and over, making corrections to worn dies. We all know that many firms had their hands in Juncker's business - W&L, K&Q, S&L to name (3). Were the Juncker EK dies salvaged from the bombing? I'll leave this not only for later, but also to someone who is doing much research in this area. It's only fair that I give this respect to him. I see some differences in your frame and the example(s) I show here. I wouldn't be alarmed at this. Like I say, I don't have any idea how many times Juncker reworked their dies.

My best,

Robert

Edited November 14, 2008 by robert pierce

[ogfm]

Hi Robert,

as i compare my L/12 mm EK2, the unmarked "Standart-Juncker" with magnetic / non-magn core and my L/12 mm EK1, i have 3 different frame and 2 different core designs. The L/12 mm EK2 has the frame from the EK1 i guess, it is a little big bigger than the other Juncker EK2. The core is different, too.

I think, we can say, that Juncker has not only one typical design like other makers. They used a lot of other frame designs (or re-worked them) and core designs (some cores like W&L) and that makes the collecting interesting.

IMO, there are only two "real" Juncker EK2 who were only made by Juncker: the L/12 mm EK2 and the "Standart". The other EK2, with Juncker frame and W&L core are made in co-production, or what do you think ?

Regards,

Oliver

[robert pierce]

I think the same as you, Oliver. We're on the same page. I believe many firms worked with Juncker to keep Juncker's production quotas met, and we find many variants which confuse things a lot. We as collectors try our hardest to piece every time table and variant together, but it just cannot be done with exactness - at least not yet. To find an L/12-marked cross which was not postwar marked is a treasure. I really like my early standard cross-hatched examples even though they're not marked because they have Juncker early frames and Juncker cores. I believe in them. But, the optimum cross is the L/12-marked cross for certain. I've enjoyed our discussion, and the sharing of information and ideas. I'm keeping my eyes open for an L/56 for you, Oliver. Happy hunting! BTW, when I have some extra time I'll resize some photos to post here.

My best,

Robert

[ogfm]

Yes, Robert.

We all have to do our homework but with all this variations on EK1 and EK2 it is not so easy sometimes.

Remember the discussion on WAF about the L/15. What we need are more documents, like Dietrich get about L/15, to say some something exactly about the manufactor, about their supplier, etc.

Without docs we just can count 1 and 1 together, but we cannot say it for 100% sure. There are so many secrets that we have to clear up and that is a lot of work...

But that can people do who have enough time...

Best wishes,

Oliver

PS: I enjoyed our discussion, too....

If you see a L55 or L/56, please contact me. I let you know, when i see a L/12 EK1 that you are searching or L/12 Ek2 or if i will sell one of my L/12.

[robert pierce]

I think it was Carsten who just sold an L/55 SB without the disc. I found it for another member who had been trying to complete his set as well. They're out there, it just takes some eye strain to find them.

I'll keep looking in my travels,

Robert

[ogfm]

Yes, Robert.

Carsten had the one in his shop without the disc, but that was a EK1....i`m searching only for EK2.....

The EK1 are not so hard to find, but he EK2 are as you know.

Someday my time will come and so the L55 or L/56.....

Best wishes,

Oliver

Edited November 16, 2008 by ogfm

[robert pierce]

You're exactly right, Oliver. I got crossed up on the EKI/EKII thing because of my excitement in finding a nice UberGrosse today. I can't think half straight when I finally find something I've been after for awhile. It takes me awhile to come back to earth. You are right, it was an EKI. I also found a very nice unknown maker EKI, which looks very close to a Wiedmann PB. So much so, it had me guessing until I compared it inhand with my Wiedmann SB. I thought it might have been a very early Wiedmann. Still, a very nice cross.

My best,

Robert

[ogfm]

Oh i know that kind of feeling very well...

Did you buy the ?bergr??e from Frank ? I saw that he has on for sale on WAF.

Oh...and a new EK1 for you ?

A very good saturday for you...

Has the Wiedmann cross you found the needle and hinge system like the round 3 Ek1 ? Or is it another and new variation of Wiedmann ?

I had a Wiedmann PB a while back in my collection. Here is a pic from it:

best wishes,

Oliver

[robert pierce]

Hi Oliver!

Yes, the UberGrosse was from Frank. I'm anxiously awaiting its arrival. And, the EKI I bought has the pin like the 'round 3'. I just finished posting another thread on it, asking if anyone knew the maker. I really like the Wiedmann PB you posted. The round catchplate, hinge and number system really give away the Wiedmann. Very nice cross.

My best,

Robert