big parade-picture 1906 - general officers.

[KIR]

Gentlemen,

I?ve got this big photo and I hope your can help me to identify the unit and the persons!

"Parade am 12. M?rz 1906"

Oberst Grosch. ?- Karl - Excellence Lobenhofer? - Oberleutnant ??? - Hauptmann J?llner?

- I think the helmet-plates are bavarian???? Maybe the picture is taken in Metz / Lothringen ???

so this two bavarian units are possible: Kgl. Bayer. 4. Inf.-Regt. and the Kgl. Bayer. 8. Inf.-Regt. ???

I will be very appreciate for any information about!

Thanks and best regards,

Jens

[KIR]

Thanks!

[Naxos]

I

Oberleutnant Hofstetter

does that read: Oberst Grossherzog Karl? (could that be the Regimental Colonel in Chief)

I agree with your other readings

Edited March 13, 2009 by Naxos

[KIR]

... thanks a lot Hardy!

But I have no bavarian Ranklist to check the names!

Thanks and best regards,

Jens

Edited March 13, 2009 by KIR

[Guest Rick Research]

AAAAGGGHH. What a MESS!!!!!!!

I have a gap between 1903 and 1909, but here goes:

There WAS no "Ho-ff-stetter." This must be

Eugen Hofstetter, born 1870. Oberleutnant 10.03.99 in 1903 K.B. Inf Rgt 23. Promoted Hauptmann 27.10.06 and in K.B. Inf Rgt 7 1909. Retired as Oberstleutnant aD from K.B. Inf Rgt 21.

Z?llner is more problematic since there wasn't one in either year-- and if the writer didn't spell Hofstetter correctly....

There was, however, a BADEN (not Bavarian) Hauptmann ZOELLNER (no accent mark) in Inf Rgt 114-- date of rank 15.13.00 Ww. There was no BADEN Oberleutnant Hoffstetter in THAT regiment though it remains poissible that the "two-f"s officer of that name WAS from some non-Bavarian regiment since BOTH NAMES ARE SPELLED WRONG.

Generalmajor (08.06.02) Friedrich Lobenhofer (born 1850) was commander of K.B. Feldart Brig 6 in 1903, but had received personal nobility with the Bavarian Order of the Crown as Ritter von Lobenhofer and retired as General der Artillerie by 1909.

It must actually say "Oberst GROSCH" and then stuck in there God-alone-knows-who whose first name was "Karl" behind HIM. There was a BAVARIAN

Feodor GROSCH, born 1854, Oberstleutnant 15.11.01 on staff of K.B. Inf Rgt 3. He was promoted Oberst 30.05.04 and in 1909 was Generalmajor (12.10.06) commanding K.B. Inf Brigade 12.

What a mess!

Edited March 13, 2009 by Rick Research

[Naxos]

Quote; "Indeed, looking at this sloppy captioning agian, I am not sure it doesn't say "Oberst GROSCH" and then stuck in there God-alone-knows-who whose first name was "Karl" behind HIM. There was a BAVARIAN

Feodor GROSCH, born 1854, Oberstleutnant 15.11.01 on staff of K.B. Inf Rgt 3. He was promoted Oberst 30.05.04 and in 1909 was Generalmajor (12.10.06) commanding K.B. Inf Brigade 12. "

Yes , Yes, Yes, Rick because = 3. K?niglich Bayerisches Infanterie-Regiment ?Prinz Karl von Bayern?

[Guest Rick Research]

Nnnnnnnnn.... still looking at that (and constantly editing trying to sort out the mess) I would NOW say that Oberst Grosch is the officer at far left standing with the crowd in the back and the squished in oversized "Karl" Wheoeverhewas is the one parading past in front of him.

If somebody actually has a Prussian AND Bavarian 1906 Rank List-- who was a Major or Oberstleutnant in BADEN Inf Rgt 114 OR a K.B. Inf Rgt then commanded by Grosch (or not ) whose first name was Karl? Because only "Karl" and "Hoffstetter" are marching past.... and the fact that senior officer Grosch is standing next to the Wandering Celebrity Bigwig suggests that "Karl" and Oberleutnant "Hoffsetter" were in GROSCH'S Regiment (whatever it was) in 1906.

Huff.

Puff.

There, by God I think I've got it as straightened out as it CAN be. :rolleyes:

Edited March 13, 2009 by Rick Research

[Naxos]

In April 1900 there was an Oberstleutnant beim Stabe in k.b. Inf. Rgt.3 named Karl Weyse

Edited March 13, 2009 by Naxos

[KIR]

... GREAT!!! Thank you very much!!!

And yes - I think Rick is right with the names and the persons on the picturer!

One thing, Hauptmann Z?llner ist wearing a white Paradebusch - or!?

Only Garde and some Grenadier-Regiments wearing the white Paradebusch:

- Gro?herzoglich Mecklenburgisches Grenadier-Regiment Nr.89 (Schwerin & Neustrelitz)

- Badisches Leib-Grenadier-Regiment Nr.109 (Karlsruhe)

- 2. Badisches Grenadier-Regiment Kaiser Wilhelm I. Nr.110 (Mannheim & Heidelberg)

- Grenadier-Regiment K?nigin Olga (1. W?rttembergisches) Nr.119 (Stuttgart)

(the Gren.R.119 also had a "special" helmet-plate: http://www.pickelhauben.net/pickelhaube/im...rtyoff/full.jpg

http://www.pickelhauben.net/identity/images/Wappen_47.gif

... I have to read all again tomorrow and think about it! But thank you very much for your great help!!!

Best regards,

Jens

[Guest Rick Research]

I can only HOPE that there is some explanation from the 1906 Rank Lists that will explain all of these officers being TOGETHER then when none of them were in 1903 or 1909!

Zoellner was killed in action at Neuve Chapelle on 2 November 1914 as a Major in Inf Rgt 56.

[KIR]

... I take a look into the (prussian) Ranklist 1912 and 1913 and found a: Major Z?llner in the

6. Badisches Infanterie-Regiment Kaiser Friedrich III Nr.114 (Stab).

... also I take a look into the (prussian) Ranklist 1903 and found some Z?llner:

Oblt.: Ldw. d. Verkehrstruppen Eisenbahn-Brigade (KO4, LD1) and a Lt.: Res.-Offz. IR29.

... also some Zoellner: Lt.: Fuss-Art. Ldw. Bezirk K?ln, Oblt.: Ldw. Inf. Bez. Berlin, Hpt.: Uffz-Schule Pommern.

and also (in the RL-1903) a Leutnant Hofstetter in the 9. Badisches Infanterie-Regiment Nr.170.

But I think there is not really a good chance to find some more about this picture!

Anyway, thank you a lot for your great help (Rick and Hardy)!!!

Best regards,

Jens