bigjarofwasps

Lorenzo, is anything known about these medals? Who they were awarded to, and for what? Gordon.

I suppose a good place to start might be...

Its surprising just how small they are, no wonder they lost so many...

Heres a few examples of silver ones I`ve seen that wouldn`t break the bank...

Anyone out there into roman coins? Was thinking of maybe starting a collection, any tips? I see that the gold examples are for the big boys, so will have to set my sights a little lower. Maybe silver ones...

Phew, can we put this one to bed now?

This speaks volumes....

Right I think that sorts that out...?? Interesting that a medic attached to the SF would get a CIB & not a CMB? Also that you could wear the CAB & CMB/CIB?

The mortar one is a bit lame I think, & by that I mean if a camp is huge like say SLB in Basra was, rounds could land on camp, but be up to a mile away from where the clerk was (he might not even hear them), would this still count.....surely not??? What about the other example, where a lone Iraq fires one pistol round at your vehicle as you drive passed....contact with the enemy?? I assume said incident would have to be called in on the radio in order to count, that being the case I wonder how many incidents like that go unreported, and how many are `beefed` up a bit by rear echelon units, in order to qualify...or am I being a sceptic?

Hi Ulster, nice to hear from you again..... So basically its down to the discretion of your commander at the time, whether he/she deems that you participation in an incident, and the incident in general is worthy of said award? There appears to be no hard & fast rules? Gordon.

Roger all that Armydoc, it all becomes clear!!!! But I wonder if you have any opinion as to what `actively engaged` might mean?

Yes I agree, welcome to the forum Armydoc, your a wealth of information, I hope you enjoy visiting the forum as much as we have enjoyed reading your replies!!!!!

a monster indeed.... Have a look at this... <a href="http://www.army.mil/symbols/combatbadges/Action.html" target="_blank">http://www.army.mil/symbols/combatbadges/Action.html</a> It appears you can be awarded all three, but it doesn`t state whether you could wear all three at once? It also goes on to state.. c. Soldier must be personally present and actively engaging or being engaged by the enemy, and performing satisfactorily in accordance with the prescribed rules of engagement. ....but doesn`t stipulate what actively engaged might mean...anyone got any ideas?

Oh now that makes more sense...and by that I mean the whole SS DSC thing, yeh I`ll have that. The way it was worded in the book gave the impression that he got two gongs and a promotion all for the same act. CMB, now I think I`ve got my head round this....so basically if you did a tour of Iraq & a tour of Afgan, because they both come under the war on terror you only get one award. If there was say a further chapter...Iran?? then you`d get a star? Or would that still count as the war on terror. Where as WWII & Korea where clearly two seperate war thus two awards....you lost me a bit with the Vietnam thing, I`m afraid. Now in the book My War, he author states that the CMB was issued purely for being a medic in a combat zone is this correct? By that I mean is it issued on mass to every medic whose served in Iraq/Afgan, or do you have to have been exposed to a two way range, is there a limit to how much fire there was or weapon type?...example a sing shot from a pistol whilst on patrol, a few mortars in the camp, an IED? Also what happens if your a medic with an infantry squad that gets into a fire fight but now one is injuried, whats happens then?

Johnny Come Lately by Steve Earle I'm an American, boys, and I've come a long way I was born and bred in the USA So listen up close, I've get something to say Boys, I'm buying this round Well it took a Iittke while but we're in this fight And we ain't going home 'til we've done what's right We're gonna drink Camden Town dry tonight If I have to spend my last pound When I first got to London it was pourin' down rain Met a Iittle girl in the field canteen Painted her name on the nose of my plane Six more missions I'm gene Well I asked if I could stay and she said that I might Then the warden came around yelling "turn out the lights" Death rainin' out of the London night We made love 'til dawn But when Johnny Come Lately comes marching home With a chest full of medals and a G.l. loan They'll be waitin' at the station down in San Antone When Johnny comes marching home MY P-47 is a pretty good ship And she took a round coming cross the Channel last trip I was thinking 'bout my baby and letting her rip Always got me through so far Well they can ship me all over this great big world But I'll never find nothing like my North End girl I'm taking her home whh me one day, sir Soon as we win this war Now my granddaddy sang me this song Told me about Londen when the Blitz was on How he married Grandma and brought her back home A hero throughout his land Now I'm standing on a runway in San Diego A couple Purple Hearts and I move a little slow There's nobody here, maybe nobody knows About a place called Vietnam

Curious about the Iraq award, how can it be issued revoked and then re issued? I also assume that a `combat injury`, has to be something that the enemy have fired at you? American awards seem to be so fickle with no rule of thumb... I`m currently reading a book (Right Face)where by the author claims to have been awarded the Silver Star promoted to 1st Lt and put in for the DSC all for them same action. Another book I recently read (The Cage) the author claimed to have won the Silver Star & Bronze Star in a week!!!! In the UK you`d be lucky to get one medal at the end of your tour! Goin slightly off topic again, but what the score with CIB & CMB I`ve seen a lot recently with 1 & 2 stars on them, I understand the criteria for there award (I think), but how does the stars work..... I mean do you get one per tour in a combat zone, or like the above medals example could you be awarded a CIB badge on day then a week later get a star and so on? We also only get one campaign medal per tour, in the US you seem to get 2+...example Iraq & war on terror medal. Don`t get me wrong I think its great I wish we could come out of basic training with 2 medals, do a tour and come home with 5!! Thats really `Johnny come lately` stuff!!!

Two UK military personnel have been killed and two seriously injured in an RAF Puma helicopter crash near Baghdad in Iraq, defence officials have said. The deaths on Tuesday take the total number of UK troops killed in operations in Iraq since the 2003 invasion to 173. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7105224.stm

So just who was the most decorated American soldier? You`d think the answer would be easy..... http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_was_the_most...merican_history But it seems not! Then you could argue.... does say the acts required to win 2 DSC & 10 SS say out rank a MH? & whilst I on about it, who was the most decorated British soldier? Could you say one of the double VC winners or the SAS guy who won 4 DSOs, or is there someone else......?

Audie Murphy's Military Award List Military Service Number 01 692 509 Medal of Honor Distinguished Service Cross Silver Star With First Oak Leaf Cluster Legion of Merit Bronze Star With "V" Device and First Oak Leaf Cluster Purple Heart With Second Oak Leaf Cluster U.S. Army Outstanding Civilian Service Medal Good Conduct Medal Distinguished Unit Emblem With First Oak Leaf Cluster American Campaign Medal European-African-Middle Eastern Campaign Medal With One Silver Star, Four Bronze Service Stars (representing nine campaigns) and one Bronze Arrowhead (representing assault landing at Sicily and Southern France) World War II Victory Medal Army of Occupation With German Clasp Armed Forces Reserve Medal Combat Infantryman Badge Marksman Badge with Rifle Bar Expert Badge with Bayonet Bar French Fourragere In Colors of the Croix de Guerre French Legion of Honor, Grade of Chevalier French Croix de Guerre With Silver Star French Croix de Guerre with Palm Medal of Liberated France Belgian Croix de Guerre 1940 Palm

Billy Walkabout, decorated American Indian veteran, dies at 57 Walkabout received the Distinguished Service Cross, Purple Heart, five Silver Stars and five Bronze Stars. He was believed to be the most decorated Native American soldier of the Vietnam War, according to U.S. Department of Defense reports.

Cheers Ed, I`ll give the book a bash.....

Ed, tell tell....... Surely he must be the most decorated American soldier that ever served? I was going to ask for his book for Christmas, but would very much like to hear your views, before I do.

Check out this... http://www.hackworth.com/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hackworth

Found this thought it might be of interest..... Slighty off topic, but its interesting none the less..... Author explodes myth of the gunmetal VC By Catriona Davies The belief that every Victoria Cross, Britain's highest military honour, is made from cannon captured during the Crimean War is nothing more than a myth, says a book marking the 150th anniversary of the medal. John Glanfield: ?There was an accepted legend and no one had researched whether it was true? John Glanfield, a historian and author of Bravest of the Brave, to be published next month, claims to have exposed the truth about the metal used to make the awards. It has long been believed that all 1,351 Victoria Crosses awarded have been made of bronze taken from two Russian cannon captured at the siege of Sebastopol and kept in the Royal Arsenal at Woolwich. The Victoria Cross was instituted on Jan 29, 1856, as the supreme gallantry award and the first to recognise servicemen's brave acts regardless of rank. The priceless lump of metal, of which there remains enough for a further 85 crosses, is kept in a vault at the Royal Logistic Corps in Donnington, Shropshire. It can be removed only under guard. By studying historical documents and scientific analysis, Glanfield claims that the Woolwich cannon were not used until 1914, 58 years after the first Victoria Crosses had been produced. He also says that the precious ingot disappeared during the Second World War, so a different metal was used for five crosses awarded between 1942 and 1945. "I was astonished," he said. "There was an accepted legend and no one had researched whether it was true. When something has been the belief for 150 years it becomes accepted as the truth." In the book, he says: "No aspect of the history of the Victoria Cross has been so hotly debated or disputed as the origin of the metal from which it is made. "The truth has become fogged by time, myth and misinformation. Part of the myth is that every cross has been cast from the two [Woolwich] cannon." advertisement The cannon in Woolwich are Chinese-made, although they have often previously been cited as Russian, and Glanfield says that their origin is an "impenetrable mystery". He said there was no evidence that they had been captured at Sebastopol, the last big battle of the Crimean War, as was often stated. "The Chinese pieces were not the only, or even the first, to contribute VC metal," he said. "An earlier gun provided bronze from the start. "When the metal ran out in December 1914, the Chinese cannon took over. The football-size cascabels [knobs] were sawn off at the neck and melted down for VC production, starting not in 1856 but nearly 60 years and some 560 crosses later." Glanfield cites unpublished X-ray analysis of crosses, carried out at the Royal Armouries and the Australian War Memorial in Canberra, showing that those awarded before 1914 were of a different metal from those afterwards. It is only those since 1914 that match the Woolwich cannon. Furthermore, an estimated 224lb of metal has been taken from the Woolwich cannon. Glanfield said that to make 12 crosses with a combined weight of 10oz or 11oz required 47oz of gunmetal because of the wastage in the process. Therefore the 224lb would have been enough to make the 810 crosses issued since 1914, but not those previously. Of the disappearance of the ingot in 1942, he said: "The wartime transfer of the VC block from Woolwich Arsenal with tens of thousands of dispersed depots may have rendered it impossible to trace." He said the War Office covered up the crisis at the time. Glanfield, who began writing after he retired as a director of the Earl's Court and Olympia exhibition centres, almost turned down the opportunity to write the book because he thought there was nothing new to learn about the Victoria Cross. However, he changed his mind because he had been inspired by VC holders he had met in his earlier career. He said: "I found all of them quiet, self-effacing and considered their acts of gallantry to be just a job. These are supermen and I relished the prospect of writing about them. Researching the book was a humbling and awesome experience." Glanfield decided to research the origins of the crosses themselves, a project that took eight months, because previous histories had concentrated on the recipients and their deeds. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...12/28/nvc28.xml

Cheers Guys, thats of great help!! Any idea what the chances of researching such an award would be? The relative I`m trying to research was 30003053 SSgt Eugeniufz Kozik, his medals & photo would suggest that he won it twice! Not sure what campaigns he fought in in total, but he was certainly at Monte Casino, and was in an Armoured unit of some kind. I`ll try and scan his picture, and see if I can post it. Leave it with me. His Cross is the 1920 type.