webr55

Rick, the back is very dark blue.... navy?

That would leave us with three suspects, however I don't know which one should have got a Colonial medal:

Rudolf Ma?mann, entered service 1.4.1902, HAE1 and EK in 1918, aD 1920 as char. KorvKap

Baron thoe Schwartzenberg en Hohenlandsberg (Friesian name), entered service 1.4.1902, HAE1 and EK in 1918, aD 1920 as char. KorvKap. He had however a prewar Norwegian St. Olav, which he might have mounted again on a postwar bar.

Ludwig Fabricius, entered service 6.4.1904, HAE1 and EK in 1918, aD 1920 as KapLt. He would only have got enough time for the XXV with overseas service.

That is very well possible. With wartime service counting double for the XXV, most officers who were "in" by 1902 got their XXV - even without colonial years.

The only info I can find is that he appears to have been a high ranking official in the German Foreign Office during the 1950s. At least Ministerialdirigent, maybe Staatssekret?r.

Regards

Chris

Got him!

This is Theodor von Bomhard (1841 - after 1911)

Born Wunsiedel 12.1.1841

(Bavarian) Unterlieutenant 16.5.1859

...

Oberst 11.12.1888

Generalmajor 12.6.1893

char. GenLt zD 25.12.1897

char. Gen der Artillerie zD 3.3.1911

He was Commander of FAR1 in 1891, Sektionschef Field Artillery Inspection in 1893, Commander of 2nd Field Artillery Brigade in 1895.

His awards per 1895 are BMV4X, BMV3X, Bavarian Crown Order Knight, St. Michael Commander 2nd, EK2, KO2, KDM70, Bavar 1866 cross, DA 2nd, Swedish Sword Order Commander 2nd and ÖFJ1 (Grand Cross). The two last ones do not show up in the 1891 RL. So this photo must have been taken sometime between 1891 and 1893 (promotion to Generalmajor), and before he got the ÖFJ1.

Trivia: He was the grandfather of SS-Gruppenführer Adolf von Bomhard.

Thanks for the numbers!

Chris

Hi David,

I have not the original rolls from Anhalt, Baden, Braunschweig, Oldenburg. Only Staatshandb?cher, for example Anhalt since 1872.

I have all classes from the prussian red eagle and the crown order with "addons" - that means swords, 50, etc. but not with "Schleife" or "Eichenlaub". There are twenty thousand of each order in all classes.

At last I have made a list of the bavarian MVK at the "Badn f?r Kriegsverdienste" - all classes - and the MVK 1. class for war-merit. Here I have only the Milit?rverordnungsblatt and not the original rolls.

But I think there are 75 - 90 %.

Best regards

Werner

Hello Werner,

have you got award numbers for the Beamtenband MVK, especially with crown?

Thanks

Chris

Hello Chris,

also a roll of the civil awards ???

I only know and have the E. Roth military roll for 1914-18.

Any help appreciated !!

greetings

eitze

You're right. The list should be more specific.

• Anhalt
  • ?
• Baden
  • KFO/BZL: published, but incomplete
• Bayern
  • MMJO: published
  • MVO/MVK: published, but incomplete
• Braunschweig:
  • BrH/BrEAK: apparently not in archive
• Bremen
  • Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published
• Hamburg
  • Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published
• Hessen-Darmstadt
  • HPO/HT: destroyed in the war?
• Hessen (Kurfürstentum):
  • House Order of the Golden Lion --> David M
  • Order of William --> David M
• Hohenzollern
  • being published
• Lippe-Detmold
  • LDH: being published
• Lübeck
  • Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published
• Mecklenburg-Schwerin
  • exist in archive, not yet published
• Mecklenburg-Strelitz
  • found, but too chaotic to be useful
• Oldenburg
  • ?
• Preußen
  • PLM/HHOX: published-- HHOX being worked on for a new edition
• Reuß ä.L. und j.L.
  • exist in archive, not yet published
• Sachsen
  • SH/SV: published
  • SA: published, but rolls not complete
• Sachsen-Altenburg
  • HSH: published, supplements being published
• Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha
  • HSH: being published
  • Carl Eduard War Cross: being published
  • Carl Eduard Medals: being published
• Sachsen-Meiningen
  • HSH: being published, but incomplete
  • War Merit Cross: being published
• Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach
  • WF: being published, but incomplete
  • Wilhelm Ernst War Cros: being published, but incomplete
• Schaumburg-Lippe
  • House Order * Decorations for Arts & Sciences: being published
• Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt und Schwarzburg-Sondershausen
  • exist in archive, not yet published
• Waldeck
  • Merit Cross 1914-18: published-- revised 2nd edition being re-published
• Württemberg
  • WKO/MVO/WF, WKrz, VK: being published

• Austria
  • Iron Crown: ?
  • ÖMK: ?

Just meant as a start, waiting for your corrections/updates.

Regards

Chris

Great job, David!

We should have a pinned thread with a list of all states' rolls, stating which have been published, will be published, found, not yet found, definitely destroyed, and so on.

Rick Research said:

The covered front button tunics with chest pockets suggest re-issue of circa 1921 Reichsheer uniforms... but not even any collar tabs. Most of those guys look older rather than younger...

I've seen several similar photos from this 1935/36 period-- none in close enough to tell if that is a cockade on their Skim?tzen or a button...

all I can guess is some sort of "make do" uniforms for reservist NCOs called up without sufficient stocks of the new Wehrmacht uniforms yet. They aren't wearing anything remotely Party oriented, so it's not as if they're SA on weekend training not worth the expense of duplicating part-time uniforms, either.

These also bear no resemblance to any police uniforms I've ever seen for the transitional "Landespolizei" types who were being absorbed en masse into the Wehrmacht.

What was your great-grandfather before and after this period?

All that makes sense. My great-grandfather was a farmer, born 1886, and had been a reserve NCO in the field artillery in WW1. I thought he was a Vizewachtmeister dR, but this photo suggests he had only been an Unteroffizier.

He was not recalled for WW2 or any Wehrmacht service. A reserve gathering is quite likely, but some apparently already had new shiny uniforms, while others simply pinned the new eagle on some old dress.

The Oberfeldwebel in the center was my grandfather's brother, Erich Reich. He was definitely a Vizewachtmeister dR and was neither recalled for WW2. There is another photo of him probably taken on the same day:

Maybe some sort of early WH uniform, or am I just missing something?

Closeup of the uniform in question. BTW, this is one of my great-grandfathers. Rank seems to be Unterfeldwebel, what do you think?

Thanks

Chris

Gentlemen,

this is a group photo taken probably around 1935/36. There are Wehrmacht NCOs sitting in the foreground and standing at the sides (some apparently with the older cap eagle, some with the new one). But the others, those with army caps, have me confused. Is that a Wehrmacht uniform, but without the WH eagle on the caps?

Sorry about the bad quality of the picture.

Chris

This is the back:

Great work! BTW, have you found Dr. Arthur Schleh somewhere?

Chris

Without having any specific information on Wechsler: In those days, "?konom" did not necessarily mean economist, but most often someone who was in an agricultural profession. There were titles like "?konomierat" - an official in agriculture.

This is a truly fascinating thread!

Chris

Poor Chinese dragon under his feet!

I thought this would be the proper place for a picture of the (Crusade style) monument erected for Graf Waldersee in Hannover, right across the street from where he lived:

This one:

Thanks for this. I have had a bit of a disaster with my computer but have found out some further information e.g. wound badge in silver (for the loss of an eye in WWI). There are pictures of him wearing another imperial or Weimar pin back award that I'm trying to figure out (gold coloured cross worn below his other pin-on awards) but I can't scan pictures at the moment. I hope to get it sorted out soon.

That's the Lippe War Honor Cross for Heroic Deeds.

Some more:

Lippe War Honor Cross for Heroic Deeds

Lippe pinback Honor Cross with Swords (a post-WW1 'dynastic' award)

Lippe War Merit Cross

Schaumburg-Lippe Cross for Loyal Service

Austrian WW1 Commemorative Medal

Sudeten Medal

Olympic Decoration (Medal or Decoration 2nd class)

SA-Treffen Braunschweig 1931 badge

Some of these can be seen on the photo of his ribbon bar below:

Some of these may be good, but some look suspicious:

- 5th row: This one is a put-together fake. The combination and precedence are totally off.

- bottom row: Suspicious combination. Too many Third Reich awards: police, party, Olympics, Social Welfare, West Wall and KVK. Theoretically possible, but suspicious.

At least the ones in row #3 and #4 have suspicious combinations as well. And - the constructions are the same as the bottom row and others. Which I'm afraid casts serious doubt on the whole group of bars.

Chris

That's a very important information you got! Sometime, somehow, these rolls will get transcribed.

David M said:

Just mailed the Braunschweig archives, hoping to find out more there!!

David

I would be interested in this, too. Did you write to the archive in Wolfenbüttel? I guess they will reply that they don't have them. Neil O'Connor did not find any, but I don't know how deep he was digging.