RobW

Hello Nick, Are you saying that is most likely that this is a group of 6 with the 1928 Showa Enthronement a later add-on? The ribbons on the other six medals appears consistent. Does the lack of the 1915 Taisho Enthronement medal raise any flags? A nice group it is. Regards, Rob

Hello Bill, It is not unusual to see such shallow strikes where the detail is very low almost flat. While the Linden leaf attachments are generally seen on the War Cross they do appear on the Czechoslovak-Belgian vics as well. There was another example posted on the Czechoslovakia vic sub-thread. A nice unofficial type 2 (Riemer) example you have there Bill. They are becoming harder to obtain in good condition. This specimen certainly complements the other unofficial type 1 (Leisek) that you have. Regards, Rob

Hello Nick, Unfortunately I didn't remember to download the pics. I recall it was sometime in 2009. Strangely enough I haven't seen another one since that time so I am not too sure of their scarcity. Regards, Rob

Hello Nick, I have seen a similar replica-reproduction of the French victory medal, complete with 'R' marking centrally placed on the lower reverse, covering the normally seen Paris mint cornucopia and BR marking. It too had the clear plastic pres-fit cover and vacuuformed felt backing. This is at least suggestive of a similar maker. I don't have any details on the originator of the piece either but noted the example on ebay France. Regards, Rob

And here is a combined composite of the two. While there appears to be a reduced level of detail noticeable on the silvered version, especially on the reverse, the common design and features seem to be apparent. Regards, Rob

Here is the silvered variety that is causing the discussion over on the other sub-thread. A closer inspection of the silvered version shows that, at least the major areas of the obverse and reverse, are very similar. This would suggest a common manufacturer or die. Regards, Rob

To all, Noting the ongoing conversation regarding a particular Romanian victory medal on the FAKES section I have a comparison to make. To bring the conversation back to the medals I have posted another Romanian local victory medal conforming to Alex Laslo's 'unofficial type 3'. Regards, Rob

To all, Great points of discussion. Could I suggest that we re-copy these last couple of posts into the Romanian vic sub-thread as that will provide context in that area as well. Regards, Rob

Hello all, I agree wholeheartedly that the term 'unofficial' coined by Alex Laslo is most appropriate when it comes to the Romanian locally produced models. There are variations and then there are variations of those variations. I have 4 Romanian groups; 3 with an unofficial Romanian vic and 1 with the official strike. It is this variety that makes collecting these items so interesting. Regards, Rob

Hello Kevin, I'm not saying it is a fake; just that it appears to be a cast copy, or one with moulding flaws on the reverse, based on an unofficial type 3. Regards, Rob

Hello Bill, It does appear to be a cast copy of the unofficial type 3. The lack of detail is especially noticeable on the reverse. Regards, Rob

Hello Oliver, If you note post #12 on this thread, by Lambert, it has pics of the obverse and reverse of the Lorioli-Castelli variety. On the reverse there is no mark of 'G.Villa' on the right hand side as viewed. Are you saying that you have seen a Loriloi-Castelli variety that has the marking of 'G.Villa' on the reverse? That would be interesting to see if it is the case. Regards Rob

Hello Oliver, Welcome to the forum and to our small group of vic enthusiasts. I am sure that you will find much assistance and help from like-minded collectors here. Regards, Rob

Jim, These are good points about the differences in the stars, end loops, fonts, and spacers; but we are still no closer to positively identifying the actual manufacturers of these different bar varieties. Given the passage of time I suspect that the relevant information, if still known or even residing in the manufacturing companies archives somewhere, will not come out. Regards, Rob

Hello Bill, That is a question that has been posed to our US collector friends some time back. No responses have been forthcoming so the hunt for information continues. Time will tell... Regards, Rob

Hello Herman, I have not seen such an example. Could you post a close-up pic of the obverse for us to compare? Regards, Rob

Hello Bill, Details from the original post on 'usmilitariaforum' indicated the gentleman in question was in the 129th Infantry Regiment of the 33rd Division. The Regiment was entitled to the following battle clasps: * Somme Offensive * Meuse-Argonne * Defensive Sector In addition they served in the following sectors: * Amiens, 27 July - 5 August 1918 * Verdun-Frommereville, 8-25 September 1918 * Troyon, 26 October - 11 November 1918 The division was involved in the last Meuse-Argonne offensive. Following the armistice the division remained in positions near the Meuse river for approximately one month. It was at that time that the Army of Occupation, or 3rd American Army was raised from the following divisions; 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 32nd, 42nd, 89th and 90th. The 33rd division was initially one of those divisions that were tasked to provide support to the Army of Occupation and guard the lines of communication. On 12 December 1918 the 33rd division was allocated to the 7th Corps and subsequently became part of the 3rd Army. It would seem logical that in the interim time between the Army of Occupation establishing itself on the Rhine, and Mozelle valley some form of 'PreOccupation' activities would have occurred, hence the unofficial bar. Interestingly; formal occupation activities occurred in Alsace and Lorraine on 8 December with elements of the 131st Infantry Regiment, of the 33rd Division, in attendance. That may explain the bottom bar. The 33rd division also found itself on occupation duties in the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg. Given all these events I can see why an individual soldier would adorn his vic with these unofficial 'Army of PreOccupation' and 'Alsace-Lorraine' bars. They may not be technically correct but at least it has given the vic some character. Hope this is of use. Regards, Rob Sources: 1. WW1 Campaign and Service Credits, Planchet Press, June 1996. 2. The History of the A.E.F., Shipley Thomas, 1920. 3. The History of the 33rd Division, A.E.F., Frederic Huidekoper, 1921.

To all, Here is an interesting vic from a group to a gentleman of the 33rd Division, recently posted on a us militaria forum. It was part of a larger Purple Heart group that also included a number of French awards. The current owner of the group has agreed to allow me to post this pic. Of note is the ARMY OF PREOCCUPATION, OFFENSIVE SECTOR and ALSACE-LORRAINE bars. These are rarely seen. Regards, Rob

Hello Bill, I wasn't bidding on these items and hence didn't win them, as I already have certificates for all three of the Legions. I waited for the auction to finish and just posted them for the information of the group. I would agree, however, that both the medal and the certificate are in good condition. Certificates from any of the legions are not easy to come by, and moreso in good condition. Regards, Rob

Hello Dieter, Thanks for the link. Always nice to have other input especially as it is a related award. Regards, Rob

And just the award certificate. Regards, Rob

And the reverse. Regards, Rob

Close up of the obverse of the medal. The ribbon is in good condition. Regards, Rob

To all, A recent bay auction finished with this nice czechoslovakian victory medal certificate. It was awarded to a Sergeant in the Russian Legion and is dated 20 March 1923. Interestingly it also has the vic as well, with a nice unblended ribbon as well. These award certificates are of such a nice design and are not seen regularly. More pics to follow. Regards, Rob

Hello Mervyn, What a wonderful group with photos ! It is often these smaller groups, that show solid and continuous; though unglamorous work, that prove to be gems. Constant service conducting mine sweeping and mine hunting was required and was dangerous work. A very nice group it is. Thanks for posting. Regards, Rob