RobW

To all, I have posted the following two items on the specific Czech vic forum thread but felt it was also of use in this thread. Here is a Czech official vic, with 'O. Spaniel' makers mark on the obverse, with a cylinder suspender. These types were replaced with the more commonly seen official vic with a barrel suspender. Note the coarse weave Czech style ribbon. Regards, Rob

Hello Tim and Kevin, I have a few official italian vic strikes with different ribbons. Some of these ribbons have been confirmed as those on the original issue by fellow italian medal collectors on a number of italian forums. In addition I have some of the italian re-issue and reproduction strikes that show some of the more recent contemporary ribbon types used. I will track all the items down and post a side-by-side comparison pic soon. Regards, Rob

Hello Mervyn, Further to post #48 here is an illustration from that reference. It shows a member of the Victorian Military Forces circa 1890 wearing the helmet plate that you have illustrated. Given that it is a black and white pic it is, of course, undetermined what colour the helmet is. It is further mentioned in that reference (page 187) that the specific helmet plate was worn on both blue and green cloth helmets. I hope this helps. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is one of my latest acquisitions. It is identified by Mr Laslo's victory medal reference book as the French unofficial type 2a 'uniface' variety. This item is not often seen. The item is 36.5 mm in diameter. There are no edge markings or BRONZE on the rim. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is one of my latest acquisitions. Identified by Mr Laslo's reference as the French unofficial type 2a 'uniface' variety. This item is not often seen and is considered rare even in France. The item is 36.5 mm in diameter. There are no edge markings or BRONZE on the rim. Regards, Rob

Here are the close-ups. The lack of a hallmark inside the wreath of the outstretched hand of victory on the obverse and the 'LA' hallmark on the reverse should be more noticeable. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is yet another Czech produced Belgian vic. It is identified as the 'unofficial type 1a' according to Mr Alexander Laslo's reference book. Produced by the firm of Alexander Leisek it is only slightly different than the previously posted unofficial type 1. It is characterised by: Obverse a thick wire or small ball suspenderthe lack of the designers name 'Paul Dubois'there is no hallmark inside the wreath held by victory. This is the only major difference between the unofficial type 1 and unofficial type 1amore defined rays underneath the feet of victory that are more widely spaced than the unofficial type 2 seriesReverse minor variations in the positioning of the surrounding wreaths as well as the finer detail of the country shieldsthe addition of a small 'LA' hallmark (denoting Alexander Leisek) at the 6 o'clock position below the centre wreath Compared to the official strike this model is generally seen in a width of just over 36mm in diameter. It is suspended by any number of differing varieties of the coarse weave Czech style ribbon and it has also been seen in both light and darker bronze base metals. Close-ups to follow. Regards, Rob

And the reverse. Regards, Rob

Hello Jean Paul, Here is my only other Belgian group. A nice group of 4 with War Cross and palm, Yser Medal, Vic, and War Medal (with 4 service bars; 1 gilt (denoting 5 silver bars) and 3 silver bars equaling 4 years service. Regards, Rob

Here is another Czech official vic, with 'O. Spaniel' makers mark on the obverse, but this time with a barrel suspender. These types are much more common than the previous cylinder suspender types. Note the coarse weave Czech style ribbon and the unofficial single linden leaf device. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is a Czech official vic, with 'O. Spaniel' makers mark on the obverse, with a cylinder suspender. These types were replaced with the more commonly seen official vic with a barrel suspender. Note the coarse weave Czech style ribbon. Regards, Rob

Hello Carol I, It is quite possible that, aside from local Romanian manufacturers, a variety of this medal was also produced by the Paris firm of M. Delande. They were a prolific medal producer and I have seen examples of their work in producing medals relating to the Great War for many countries including Czechoslovakia, Italy, as well as the Japanese and US Victory and many others. I have attached a picture of an illustration from the 1934 catalogue of M. Delande, where it shows the Romanian Commemorative Cross suspended by a ball and with what appears to be a smaller ball suspender. I hope this is of use. Regards, Rob

Here are the close-ups. The 'R' hallmark on the reverse should be more noticeable. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is a Czech produced Belgian vic. It is identified as the 'unofficial type 2' according to Mr Alexander Laslo's reference book. Produced by the Prague firm of Edward Riemer it is characterised by: Obverse a thick wire or small ball suspenderthe lack of the designers name 'Paul Dubois'more defined rays underneath the feet of victoryReverse minor variations in the positioning and finer detail of the country shieldsthe addition of a small 'R' hallmark (denoting Riemer) at the 6 o'clock position below the centre wreath Compared to the official strike this model is generally wider at over 37mm in diameter with examples being seen with either a thicker or thin planchet. It is suspended by the coarse weave Czech style ribbon and it has also been seen in both light and darker bronze base metals. Other examples have been identified with an unofficial single linden leaf symbol attached to the ribbon. I hope it is of use. Close-ups to follow. Regards, Rob

No worries Tony. I am a big believer in getting the information out there amongst the collecting fraternity. If you think I can help let me know. Regards, Rob

Mervyn, A fascinating area of study is the Australian Colour Patch system. It was introduced in the Great War and has been used in some form since then. The sheer volume of unit patches would be an interesting study in itself. Regards, Rob

To all, Just when you thought 'it was safe to go back in the water' here is yet another Australian badge reference book. In the days before Australian Federation in 1901 the individual states were separate entities. This lead to a wide variety of state militia units and consequently some very interesting badges. This book is a very good pictorial listing of the military badges of New South Wales, Victoria, Queensland, South Australia, Western Australia and Tasmania before Federation. ISBN : 0 909458 22 7 Copyright : 2000 316 pages, black and white illustrations. Unfortunately this book is long out of print and quite difficult to obtain. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is the accompanying miniature for the Brazil vic. Produced in France it is not often found. 15.5mm diameter. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is a Brazil vic. It was originally on loan to me for research purposes but is now happily part of my collection. An official type 2 according to Mr Laslo's book (no edge mintmark). Regards, Rob

Hello Mervyn, Item located. PM sent. Regards, Rob

Hello Tim, I have posted a few times so far with elements of my vic collection, in the applicable country sections. So far I can recall posting a couple of items in the Czechoslovak, France, Great Britain and Japan vic threads as well a few more in the 'Rest of the world' vic topic. On that thread I have also posted a couple of panoramic shots of all the standard victory medal types so you may want to have a look there. I will be posting more pics here on this thread of the Czech produced Belgian vics and then eventually others in the applicable country listing. This will be dependent on my work and my temperamental scanner. It would, of course, be advantageous for a single Victory medal thread to be established. This would allow different sub-threads as they relate to each country. As far as I can tell, aside from the United Nations Service Medal for Korea in numerous languages, no other medal has the real international flavour and agreed upon design as does the Vic; but then again I'm sure the administrators are aware of all this. I agree that the Italian model is definitely a well designed and evocative piece, manufactured by no less than 7 different producers !! More pics to follow when I have time. Regards, Rob

To all, Here is the first of a few pics. A Belgian vic with 'Mothers Bar'. This is an original bar, noting that the black enamel is flush with the top surface and edge rim of the bar. There is a later contemporary copy of the bar which is slightly longer and wider than the original, and has a wider rim. It does not however have the black enamel centre; it is just a black painted hollowed recess. I have a contemporary copy as well which I shall post a pic of for comparison and reference. I have finally worked out to use my scanner more effectively which should result in better images. More to follow. Regards, Rob

Hello Mervyn, I will check the local Sydney resources tomorrow and reply by PM if any are available. In the meantime, and while awaiting a response, I would suggest you drop over to <abebooks.com>. I know that there are a few copies there. I'll let you know what I find out. As for posting; you never know some Australians, they could just be a shy lot !! Regards, Rob

Hello Tim, Being just a victory medal collector I have a few different Belgian victory medal varieties and sub-varieties. Out of all the victory medals I would say that the Belgian issue is a favourite due to the fineness of the strike and design, but that is just a personal perspective! What makes it more unique to me is that the design was used as the interim model authorised to be worn by Czechoslovak forces until their own specific model was produced later from 1926 onward, as well as the French produced uniface model and the other French produced version by 'Chobillon' of the late 1920s-1930s. It is particularly interesting that it could be manufactured by at least 5 different firms from at least 3 different countries. In addition I have also seen a French Great War medal group with a French-Belgian vic uniface model, instead of the official French vic model. I also have a Belgian vic full size in silver with a hallmark on the suspension ring and a mini in silver as well; and within the purely Belgian produced version there are a number of different finishes (dark or lighter bronze or a buffed appearance) that add to the mixture. When I have time I will post pics of some more different varieties of the Czech-Belgian vics that I have which were produced by Alexander Leisek and Edward Riemer, as well as others. I hope they will be of use to others. Regards, Rob

Hello Jean Paul, No worries, happy to share ! Being an Interallied Victory medal collector that particular Belgian African mini group is probably my nicest victory medal group, aside from a nice Cuban group of 4. The only other Belgian group I have is a full-size group with a War Cross with palm, Yser Medal, Vic, and War Commemorative medal with 4 service bars. What piqued my curiosity with this particular Belgian African mini group was the fact that it was indeed awarded for service in Africa which further illustrated to me the global impact of the Great War. While a great deal of interest in the Great War has focused on those events that occurred in the France and Belgium areas, some people forget that the Great War was, in effect, fought on a global scale. I recall having a wish list of items that I felt would enhance my victory medal collection and one of those was a nice mini group from somewhere else other than a European battlefield. As luck would have it I managed to obtain this Belgian African mini group shortly thereafter. I shall post pics of my Belgian full-size medal group when I have the time. Regards, Rob