Hilf! Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe that is!

[W McSwiggan]

Question Guy Again!

I recently became aware (earlier thread) of the K?nig Ludwig-Kreuz as a nominal equivalent to the Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe.

I wonder ? is there more to the list? I have:

Preussen - Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe

Bayern - K?nig Ludwig-Kreuz

Sachsen ? Kriegsverdienstkreuz

.

.

.

[Gerd Becker]

Question Guy Again!

I recently became aware (earlier thread) of the K?nig Ludwig-Kreuz as a nominal equivalent to the Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe.

I wonder – is there more to the list?  I have:

Preussen - Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe

Bayern - K?nig Ludwig-Kreuz

Sachsen – Kriegsverdienstkreuz

.

.

.

←

Yeah, i have asked myself the same lately. But i guess, the most states had a Merit-Medal , that filled that role. Let me take a look in my Nimmergut....

back in a few minutes....

Gerd

[Gerd Becker]

Well, these are the results. I guess this awards compare to the Prussian War Merit Cross:

Baden-Kriegsverdienstkreuz

Saxon-Weimar-Honorcross for Homelandmerits (?)

Saxon-Coburg-Gotha-Honorbadge(-medal) for homelandmerits

Gerd

[Guest Rick Research]

for WW1 war merit, which these were specifically for, the last "royal" one would be

W?rttemberg's Wilhelmskreuz (with and without swords)

[W McSwiggan]

Wow - talk about speedy replies!

Thanks Gerd & Rick.

These awards have "slipped under my radar' & I had thought that the Prussian award was a bit of an exception - then these others started coming to my attention.

Wurttemberg's was a bit of a surprize - knew of it but always thought of it more as a rear echelon award more than "hilf" award.

[Guest Rick Research]

Prussian War Effort Crosses and what they were given for:

BAVARIAN Head Teacher and accountant of the local Savings and Loan Association in Herzheim, Palatinate, 1917--

must have sent in LOTS of War Bonds stamp money from the community, Gold-I-gave-For-Iron drives and the like... but a BAVARIAN!

As was common, there was quite a delay between when the certificate was issued and he could pop in and pick up his actual cross:

[Guest Rick Research]

Clerk Petty Officer K?hne never heard a shot fired-- got this for 4 years of processing paperwork at Wilhelmshaven Naval Station

But unlike mere civilians, there was almost no delay between bestowal and receiving his cross.

I have NO idea why there was usually a gap often of years between paperwork and decoration delivery for THIS of all Prussian awards!!!! :speechless-smiley-004:

[Guest Rick Research]

Case in point: Herr Wustrow of Berlin, "book dealer"--

1) Congratulations from Berlin Police Chief Matthias von Oppen (his desertion triggered the Kaiser's abdication, when the capital's cops abandoned Berlin's streets to the Reds in November 1918), enclosed is the cross, please return the delivery receipt

2) The actual award document, dated several weeks earlier (and most unusually, with a pre-printed date, not a blank filled in)

3) Things WERE rather busy, what with the end of the war, collapse of the Empire, Red revolutionaries battling Freikorps in the streets, gunfire, murders, assasinations and all... "i.V." (no von Oppen!) and "k. pr." pared out of the stamp... and yet: von Oppen's cover letter said he was ENCLOSING "said decoration" so what the...??? ???CROSS delivered BEFORE this paperwork????

Herr Wustrow, seller of books, would get the Lifesaving Medal on Ribbon in 1928:

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?s=&showtop...ost&p=28157

[Guest Rick Research]

The Prussian War Effort Cross was intended to preserve the prestige of the Iron Cross 2nd Class on "white-black" ribbon, and yet that was not always the case--

Bezirksfeldwebel Sprungmann (probably actually an Unteroffizier from other clues to his life, "Bezirksfeldwebel" being a TITLE not a RANK) of Military District Command II Altona:

This War Effort Cross was actually "handed out" 1 November 1918

Too bad! Double dipped! Got the "EK2w" on the ex-Kaiser's birthday in 1920, probably as a discharge "present."

[W McSwiggan]

Hi All,

Still working on this one...

Another has come to my attention courtesy of Dave Danner's site. That would be the Kriegsehren-Medaille from Lippe-Detmold.

wem

[Guest John Harman]

Hi All,

Still working on this one...

Another has come to my attention courtesy of Dave Danner's site.  That would be the Kriegsehren-Medaille from Lippe-Detmold.

wem

←

...and here's one, on the war-merit ribbon. It could also be awarded on reversed-color ribbon for merit at home. It was instuted by F?rst Leopold IV. zur Lippe on 25 October, 1915.

[Guest John Harman]

Oh yeh, also add these to the list:

Mecklenburg-Schwerin: Friedrich Franz-Kreuz (not to be confused with the Milit?r Verdienstkreuz)

Mecklenburg-Strelitz: Adolf Friedrich-Kreuz

Oldenburg: Kriegsverdienstmedaille

Reuss: Medaille f?r aufopfernde T?tigkeit in Kriegszeit

[W McSwiggan]

John,

Great additions to the list - I'm feeling a little inadequate here because I've found reference to each award on the list in my own library and have overlooked them all!

Better increase my medications...

wem

[David Gregory]

I don't know where you want to draw the line for this sort of award, but you might also consider adding the 1914/1918 Kriegserinnerungskreuz of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha.

It certainly seems to have been awarded to non-combatants, so it ought to be a match for the other awards mentioned above.

I have started a thread on this rather obscure award at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1201

Edited June 19, 2005 by David Gregory

[W McSwiggan]

Hard to respond to your question as I am VERY unfamiliar with this particular award. If the naming is truly representative of this award as a commemorative then I would tend to say that it is a different class. My understanding of the Prussian award was that it was "rank blind" and intended for support of the war effort not involving military operations. I could see this as an award for charitable donations, contributions to the war effort and to officials who never caught a whiff of gunpowder! As special sybolism, if my recall is correct, the first award went to Hindenburg!!! Pretty quirky in my estimation...

[David Gregory]

According to Hessenthal & Schreiber the 1914/1918 Kriegserinnerungskreuz of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha was a commemorative award, but it does not specify whether it was for combatants or non-combatants only.

As I mentioned in the thread showing the award, I have only seen it mounted with a red cross award, so I assume it was given to non-combatants, particularly in view of the fact that Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha had other bravery and merit awards for military personnel.

Whoever has the Nimmergut 4-volume series or a book dedicated to awards of this duchy ought to be able to shed more light on the matter.

[Guest Rick Research]

I couldn't resist both the immaculate condition of these two documents and the potential for some mid-winter civilian research.

Here's a Prussian War Effort Cross award document dated 7 March 1917 to Geheimer Oberregierungsrat (= civil service "colonel") and vortragender Rat in the Ministry of Trade and Industry, Dr Friedrich Huber:

Typically, the document itself was inexplicably issued over a year later, on 18 April 1918:

I have never understood WHY this should have been the routine case!

[Guest Rick Research]

As in the case of the Wustrow pair above, it is the "cover letter" that improves the tale--

here is the accompanying All Purpose letter from Staatminister "Sydow," the Minister for Trade and Industry, 20 March 1917 notifying Dr. Huber that the king had bestowed the KHDK upon him "at my request" (you WILL remember to send me a VERY nice present on my birthday! ), congratulating him, forwarding said cross, and requesting return of the attached receipt:

Both Minister Sydow and Dr Huber were bashful fellows-- neither appear in the 1908/09 Orders Almanac (Sydow might at a different and lower job). I'd expect Huber was then past 50 and should have been holding a Red Eagle 4th, Crown 3rd, and on his way to a Red eagle 3 with Bow. I'd also expect him to be a prime candidate for a "white-black" EK2 and a variety of other WW1 war effort awards.

At this point I have NOTHING on him.

[Guest Rick Research]

Here from the 1917 Hof und Staatskalendar is Dr Huber, occupying top positions in both Sections II (Trade) and III (Industry) of the Prussian Ministry of both:

[Guest Rick Research]

Now that Paul has the 1918 Reichs civil service "Rank List," brought back up to see what is listed for Dr. Huber....

[Dave Danner]

Now that Paul has the 1918 Reichs civil service "Rank List," brought back up to see what is listed for Dr. Huber....

The Ministry for Trade and Industry was a Prussian ministry, so it's in a different book from the German State Handbook. Here is the entry for Huber in the 1918 Prussian Court and State Handbook, which uses a pretty little icon for the Verdienstkreuz f?r Kriegshilfe. You're right on target about the RAO4 and KO3.

Cordial greetings,

Dave

[Dave Danner]

Here is Minister Sydow's entry:

Edited August 21, 2007 by Dave Danner

[Dave Danner]

Here is Minister Sydow's entry:

Sorry, I uploaded the same entry again and this software won't allow me to delete the wrong attachment and include the right one. If a moderator could fix it that would be most appreciated. Here is the correct entry.

Best regards,

Dave

[Guest Rick Research]

"mid-winter civilian research..." 9 November 2005 to today, 15 December 2007!

Just got Paul C's copied 1918 Prussian Court & State and here he is, from obscurity to obscurity, Dr. Huber !!!

Ministry of Trade & Industry, two entries on page 122, showing him with Red Eagle 4, Crown 3, and the Prussian War Effort Cross:

[Guest Rick Research]

And the harried Dr. Huber at a THIRD job for his one salary, ALSO serving in the Ministry of the Interior's Statistical Central Commission:

Thanks Paul!