Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Share Posted April 28, 2007 I thought I would share some pics of the newest addition to my collection. A second pattern BO. I hope you enjoy them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 another Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 another try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 one more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted April 28, 2007 Share Posted April 28, 2007 Is there a way to look up that number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 Not at this time. The lists for the second type have not been located by number. Maybe someday I hope1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted April 28, 2007 Share Posted April 28, 2007 About all that can be said is it's a 6 May 1942 award from the very last batch ever handed out-- overwhelming to Austrians.I have never understood why the Blood Order, with its 8-9 November 1923 origin, was used-- in what turned out to be the vast majority of cases-- for AUSTRIANS who joined the Nazi Party between 1933 and 1938. That must have REALLY annoyed all those 1920s pre-power German Nazis who got absolutely nothing at all, when there was no giant jackbooted Third Reich next door to back up the neighboring come-latelies. I've always thought that a German Nazi at the 1929 Nuremberg Rally, say, was more "deserving" (not knowing if anything would ever come of their movement) than a Viennese arrested for passing out leaflets in 1936. There MUST be a complete roll for these still in existence somewhere in all the captured NSDAP archive material. I've been waiting since Klaus Patzwall's list of recipients came out in the 1980s for all the 2nd Type to have SOMEBODY get hold of the NSDAP records and list them. But then I'm still working on never published 1914-1918 records... so maybe in another lifetime! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 28, 2007 Author Share Posted April 28, 2007 Rick, I think that those Austrians who were awarded the BO did deserve it. A lot of them were jailed and wounded for the NSDAP cause. Many of those who attended the Munich Putsch were never shot at or they stood guard at remote locations away from the fighting or were supporters who lost their jobs because of their support for the party. Being that aprox. 4100 of thses were awarded it makes it rarer than the Knights Cross for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted April 29, 2007 Share Posted April 29, 2007 The last award number I have is for this AustrianKOHLER RICHARD Party Number 916530 Blood Order number 4097 GARMISH 31/01/1944 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 29, 2007 Author Share Posted April 29, 2007 Warlord, Interesting that the BO was awarded as late as 1944. I always thought that 1942 was the last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 The last Post award was made to Hydrick in 1942. The last listing by Patzwall is given as 6 May 1942 and the last and highest number given is 4033. One can deduce that possibly a small number were awarded from this time. Taking into account that by 1942 most of those who would have qualified would have put their submision in for consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 30, 2007 Author Share Posted April 30, 2007 Warlord, So it is safe to assume that no more BO's were issed after 4100? Where did you get your info on the Kohler BO awarded in 1944? Thanks, Erich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 No I would not say it was safe to say that. The other interesting point is the medals with the 3950 - 4000 seem to be much inferior to the other medals. A number of point, the numbering is just one. THER IS THE POSSIBILITY OF MULTIPLY USE OF DIES. BUT THIS IS QUESTIONABLE. I have had, and I wish I had not parted with it, the mule of the First pattern and the Second pattern. All in All this is a medal that need far more research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erich S Posted April 30, 2007 Author Share Posted April 30, 2007 I kinda disagree with when you say the detail is lacking on all BO's starting at 3950. My example i feel is in very good cond. and the details are very sharp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 I think you have to have the pieces together in hand. I am not saying the later pieces are not OK, but compared to the striking of those in the 2000 range a lot is lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VINLAND30 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 [Has anyone seen this mark on a blood order? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VINLAND30 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 My Blood Order is numbered in the very low 5000 range so who ever said they stopped at 4000 might be mistaken? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I believe the Blood Order shown is infact a Souval copy. Hence the number 5000 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VINLAND30 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I believe the Blood Order shown is infact a Souval copy. Hence the number 5000 ?5514 is the number .What is a Souval copy? I have never heard of it? Why do they believe they only went to 4000 range? Is it possible to research the recipients number on them?Thank you and take care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WAR LORD Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 I was considering this piece as a COPY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isonzo Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 War Lord is on the right way. It is 100 % a copy. Best isonzo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanCz Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 It is very definately a copy - - - I believe that they date from the mid/late 1950's early 1960's period. They do however make for a good "spacefiller" because they are a quality striking. The very first Blood Order I purchased many years ago was alas a Souval copy - - - a lovely piece and I still have it in my "Black Museum" I have learned a lot since those early days !I have never been able to find/afford a second pattern B O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VINLAND30 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 You guys were right! LOL I am ending up with a larger black museum than I would like at this point LOL What is funny is allot of the better earlier reproductions are comming on the market now because older collections are commig on the market.I agree it is a good space filler.Looking at the price of a period one yes it is a great space filler. I don't think I could buy a second pattern either at the moment .Do you know what the Souval's go for on today's market if you would guess? Who was Souval? Were they a period WW2 manufacturer? I have a funny story. Two years ago I got a call from a guy in Oregon about a mint SS Honor ring that his uncle had given him and he had it in his saftey deposit box.He said he wanted $4000 cash on the spot for it and it had to be picked up in person.He emailed me a photo of the ring which looked great. The story was his uncle had one he brought back from the war as did his vet friend. His uncle's was worn but his fellow vet's was in perfect condition. So at one of their reunions in the 1970's his buddy offered to trade the ring for his with cash in between ofcourse.The uncle then held the ring in his saftey deposit box with his other items until he died in the late 1980's which then went to his nephew.He then took over the box and kept the ring there till recently when he called telling me his story.He had showed it to a local miliataria dealer and they offered him a hefty sum on the spot for it he said. We discussed price and I was ready to fly and pick it up and ordered tickets and booked a hotel. I though before I go that I would show the photo to an expert in the field but I was so certain I didn't even think to ask anyone. Five hours before I was supposed to fly to pick it up I get an email from an expert in the field telling me the ring was a quality reproduction from the late 1960's.I called the guy and told him and he didn't belive me.So this business of collecting is horrific when it comes to reproductions. Most vets I have met don't remeber what they brough home or picked up after the war either and if they did have anything good they sold it at their garage sale in the 1970's for $25 LOL. It is very definately a copy - - - I believe that they date from the mid/late 1950's early 1960's period. They do however make for a good "spacefiller" because they are a quality striking. The very first Blood Order I purchased many years ago was alas a Souval copy - - - a lovely piece and I still have it in my "Black Museum" I have learned a lot since those early days !I have never been able to find/afford a second pattern B O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VINLAND30 Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 I was considering this piece as a COPY.Thank you for the information . It is good they didn't put low numbers on these and leave the L58 off LOL I guess the detail is slightly off too unless they call it wear as I saw on one website LOL Cheers Take care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanCz Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Rudolf Souval did indeed manufacture awards/decorations during the Third Reich era - - - and they continued to do so for a number of years after the war had ended. The catch on these particular pieces is the clue as to when they were made. Personally I woould not be happy with any Souval piece in my collection - - - my only examples are the post war copies in my "Black Museum". Nevertheless these are now collectors items in their own right - - - and they sell for a good price because of their quality manufacture - - - but remember they are copies !!I have been collecting for about 40 years now and have a great many stories - - - and I too have made some dreadful blunders - - - - but I still love this hobby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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