Imperial German Sea Pilot Badge

[Vic Diehl]

H. Schaper marked on pin. Is this a know maker? Is this a real badge?

[Vic Diehl]

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[Vic Diehl]

3

[Guest Rick Research]

I'm no help on whether the badge is good or not (especially from the awful camera shots). Schaper made a lot of naval air badges, but I'd have said in gilt bronze (MASSIVE heavy things I've never understood them taking off with-- all that extra weight!!!! )

But what is the engraving supposed to say?

[Vic Diehl]

Rick: Thanks for your input, I did not even know this maker. Here are couple more shots from the seller

[Vic Diehl]

side view--another terrible pic.

[Vic Diehl]

Rick, I see sites that discuss Army pilot and observer badges, but do you know of one that discusses these navy pieces.

I do like the engraving, the shaping of some of the letters and numbers. I picked up Wolfgang Wiesand's dagger and it is cryong out for a badge.

[Vic Diehl]

Rick, I see sites that discuss Army pilot and observer badges, but do you know of one that discusses these navy pieces.

I do like the engraving, the shaping of some of the letters and numbers. I picked up Wolfgang Wiesand's dagger and it is crying out for a badge.

[Ferg1]

Hi, it is difficult to judge from the pictures but on first impression I would say that the badge is good. It seems to conform ,from what I can see, to known pieces by HUGO SCHAPER. That maker did ,in fact,produce examples from solid 800 silver and marked them with crescent ,crown and 800.Whether that was war time or 1920's we do not know. The pin catch is in the right position unlike the fakes which are not and the pin itself looks to be right as does the MM . Shows convincing wear and patina . Really I need better pictures to make a 100% judgement but seems OK. Ferg1.

[Vic Diehl]

Email I received today, which adds to the discussion.

Crown and Halfmoon punch mark are never a good sign. Engravings are widely

forged as well.

If I had to buy a piece I would go for a standard bronze gilt one. Example

of a "Land Flieger" attached, the sea flieger looks the same from the

reverse and basic features of the front.

Andreas

[Stogieman]

I would go one step further... the marks are consistent with the few silver-marked navy badges I have seen from Schaper. I concur on the pin/hinge.

BUT, I would not spend money on a badge based on these photos. An Army one can be determined well, even from crap pictures. A Navy one.... HUGE roll of the dice.

[Vic Diehl]

1

[Stogieman]

I would be careful about the comment regarding "crown & half moon".... Yes, JUNCKER made badges are known to NOT have that mark... However, other badge makers DID use them....

A lack of knowledge can be a very bad thing......

[Stogieman]

Textbook Schaper Sea Pilot Badge in gilded bronze

[Stogieman]

Reverse:

[Stogieman]

Observer in Gilded Silver...

[Stogieman]

Reverse. Possibly Juncker/Meybauer. Note content mark. Note very crude, period repair.

[Stogieman]

Bullion version of Sea Pilot, Unknown maker.

[Stogieman]

Reverse:

[Stogieman]

Prinzen=gr??e Land Pilot, Gilded Bronze

[Stogieman]

reverse

[Stogieman]

Meybauer Land Pilot in gilded bronze

[Stogieman]

reverse

[Ferg1]

Some interesting marine badges stogiman ,but I feel a little uneasy about the sea pilot badge shown ( first example) I have never seen a sea pilot badge by Schaper like that one,it does not seem anything like the usual examples, pin ,catch, maker mark and obverse detail all seem very different, not one I have seen before by Hugo Schaper.Ferg1.

[Vic Diehl]

Fantastic responses and great photos. I have very limited knowledge on these rare pieces and this series of posts has really helped me clarify some thinking. I really appreciate the time each of you have taken to educate a novice.

Vic