Spanienkreuztr?ger Foto

[Jacques]

here are the close up. there are not clear enough to assert that it is drop tail eagle. 'll check my other pictures, some are much more clear.

[Jacques]

second one

[Harrier]

Thank you, Jacques, for taking the trouble to make these enlargements!

I must still politely disagree with you at this point. I see no sign whatsoever of any outward curve to the tails, instead only a solid downward curve (very much like the end of the embroidery on an army general's collar tab).

Whatever the end result, period photographs are our best source of information, and you have certainly shared a lot of good ones!

[Jacques]

Thank you, Jacques, for taking the trouble to make these enlargements!

I must still politely disagree with you at this point. I see no sign whatsoever of any outward curve to the tails, instead only a solid downward curve (very much like the end of the embroidery on an army general's collar tab).

Whatever the end result, period photographs are our best source of information, and you have certainly shared a lot of good ones!

I don't think that we can assert on the base of these blurry pictures, that crosses with drop tail eagles are period made.

I don't think these crosses original because until know, I never saw one with good reputable original pin/hook/hinge. Nevertheless, I'm ready to change my opinion if I can see a period picture showing clearly such cross (not these two pics) and if I see a cross with a good pin/hinge and no re-soldered eagles. Honestly, I never scrutinized my pics to find such details, but I will do. It should be a revolutional discovery, at least for me !

jacques

[Jacques]

Some manufacturers have eagles with a not so spreaded tail.

this cross is original , and the eagle tail could easily ,on a blurry picture, make the confusion.

[Harrier]

An interesting cross and one which itself might be rejected by many on first glance.

I hope a really good photo alone might satisfy your criteria. The added test of actually seeing one in person might not ever happen..........

Many thanks, again, for these great photos from the Heer and Kriegsmarine!

[Scott]

After playing around with my camera and a Silver Sp. Cross w/Swords on a tunic, I believe under certain lighting/focus conditions - like those in Jacques' period photos above - the eagle's tail will tend to fade out of the photo due to the brightness of the rest of the eagle/cross.

In my fuzzy photo below, you can get the idea. Note how the tails of the eagles have nearly disappeared, taking on the look of droop-tails - when compared to the same cross in focus...

Scott

Edited December 12, 2007 by Scott

[Harrier]

Very nice job, and thanks!

I must say that I appear, so far, to be in the minority here (which I fully accept without

difficulty). I invite everyone, however, to take more looks at this, including at Scott's good work, and look closely at the head of the eagle, then follow it back down the curve of the tail. The head of the eagle, on standard crosses, does not match the head size of the one in Jacques' photos, nor does the curve flow back from the head, into the "shoulder" area and down to the end of the tail as on the cross in those photos. If you can picture in your mind the eagle on the "droop-tail" crosses we have all seen in the past (and considered bad) and then compare that image to what we are seeing here, I believe you will begin to wonder if this isn't that same style eagle or at least an eagle that is MUCH more in line with a "droop-tail" than a "standard tail". I'm sure, as Jacques says, that there are manufacturer's variations which deviate a bit from the standard eagle, but I am still convinced that what is shown in Jacques' photos is not "explainable" that way.

Oh, for a crystal clear close-up wartime photo which no one could doubt....... Keep digging, Jacques!

[Jacques]

Very nice job, and thanks!

I must say that I appear, so far, to be in the minority here (which I fully accept without

difficulty). I invite everyone, however, to take more looks at this, including at Scott's good work, and look closely at the head of the eagle, then follow it back down the curve of the tail. The head of the eagle, on standard crosses, does not match the head size of the one in Jacques' photos, nor does the curve flow back from the head, into the "shoulder" area and down to the end of the tail as on the cross in those photos. If you can picture in your mind the eagle on the "droop-tail" crosses we have all seen in the past (and considered bad) and then compare that image to what we are seeing here, I believe you will begin to wonder if this isn't that same style eagle or at least an eagle that is MUCH more in line with a "droop-tail" than a "standard tail". I'm sure, as Jacques says, that there are manufacturer's variations which deviate a bit from the standard eagle, but I am still convinced that what is shown in Jacques' photos is not "explainable" that way.

Oh, for a crystal clear close-up wartime photo which no one could doubt....... Keep digging, Jacques!

Hi checked around 400+ period pictures showing portraits with spanish cross worn from all branches (LW, Heer , KM) and didn't find one, enough clear, that can undoubtly proove the drop tail eagle as a period manufacture.

I keep digging, but I'll soon find water...

jacques

[Harrier]

Jacques,

Thanks very much for your efforts. I hope, rather than water, you will find oil so that it will at least be profitable!

Best,

Harrier