Whaaaaaat?

[Chris Boonzaier]

Does this say "I was made to trick tourists!"

Or does it say "This belongs to XXX, fighter pilot extraordinary!"

Have had this for ages and have always been meaning to ask.....

[Chris Boonzaier]

2

[Chris Boonzaier]

3

[Satsuma]

Hi Chris!

This looks very genuine to me, including the stains that are, in all probability, the owner's blood. It would have been taken, as a grusome souvenir, by an allied fighter from a dead Japanese serviceman.

Not too rare but an interesting part of any collection. I mean, of the roughly 20,000 Japanese soldiers defending Iwo Jima, about 19,800 died. And, as most soldiers carried these flags, you would estiamte there were, in theory, many thousand available as "souvenirs" from this campaign alone.

I apologise I can't translate. However, the writing would be signatures and well wishes from (as examples) class mates, his neighbours, or family and friends. Sometimes "good wishes" would be "death is the greatest honour!"

On eBay you would expect (roughly) US$150 to US$200.

Is image three a different flag or the reverse side of the flag in the opening image. Being silk (I'm guessing) you should see the writing on the obverse side, in reverse, on the reverse side. If it is all the one flag then this is surprising and would be the only extent to which I would doubt its authenticity.

Keep well

Satsuma

[Brian Wolfe]

Hello Chris,

I agree with Satsuma in that you should see the writing coming through the reverse side of the flag. At least this is the case in all of the ones I've seen, including the one I have. These are indeed messages of well-wishers. Another common wish, which is on my example, is for a long and glorious career in the military.

I do not agree that the stains are necessarily blood, it is however a common myth. I would suggeest that these are sweat stains. These were stored in the soldier's helmet to provide additional padding and therefore were susceptible to staining.

I would be interested in what the other members have to say.

Regards

Brian

[Gunjinantiques]

Definately real. Owner's name was Sumasu Tsunekazu. Always nice to attach a name...

[Chris Boonzaier]

Hi, the writing does indeed come through... the last pic is a different flag with nothing on it.

[Brian Wolfe]

Hi, the writing does indeed come through... the last pic is a different flag with nothing on it.

Thanks for clearing that up Chris.

For the life of me I couldn't figure out how anyone could write anything on the flag without it showing through.

Regards

Brian

[Tim B]

Some of these prayer flags were silk, others more of a silk/rayon material and the writing shows through as the material is quite translucent. I know cotton was used as well, though not sure if it was used on the prayer flags.

Here's mine and the material is very fine (rayon/silk).

I agree with Brian, the stains are most likely sweat stains from carrying them on the body or in the helmet.

Tim

[Tony]

I've always found these flags interesting but have never bought one because as Chris mentions, unless you can read Japanese you wouldn't know if it says tricked tourist or not.

Tim has answered a couple of questions I wanted to ask, silk, artificial fabrics or cotton. Also about them being carried on the body as well as under the tin hat.

But what about the tabs and strings in the corners? Is it unusual to find them with these and were the tabs leather? I see Tim's flag still has them attached.

Could the red centre piece also be written on or was that frowned upon?

Tony

[Gunjinantiques]

EVERYTHING you ever wanted to know about Japanese flags and 1000 stitch belts can be found here: http://www.gethistorytoday.com/

[Tim B]

But what about the tabs and strings in the corners? Is it unusual to find them with these and were the tabs leather? I see Tim's flag still has them attached.

Could the red centre piece also be written on or was that frowned upon?

Hi Tony,

I'll let the PIC's do the talking.

Tim

[Tim B]

Tony,

I wanted to add that it would be in your best interests to ask someone that can translate any of the Kanji on a flag you might be interested in. Also, the lettering on some of the fakes all have the same "type" brush strokes, so take your time and ask lots of questions on forums like this one prior to purchasing any flag.

I got lucky and had some fellow collectors help me with mine. Based on the information I got from the seller and some collectors that can read these, I made a plate for mine. Not complete, but best I can do for now. Enjoy!

Tim

[Tony]

Thanks very much for the help.

As I'm not a collector of WWII items I only ever buy odd things that take my fancy from that period. I have always wanted to buy one of these flags but am not prepared to spend top dollar on one.

It's strange that as every soldier had one and so many are still around that fakes are made but if the punter can't read Japanese I suppose it's easy money. I trawled through ebay today a saw quite a number for sale, many from Japan and the prices appeared ok.

If I see any that take my fancy I'll post a pic here.

Tony

[alex82]

@Tim B: that is a very nice flag I recognice the bit caracter in the center of the rising sun of the second flag you posted it is "力". I only know a little Chinese where it is spoken as "Li" which means power. I think "力" has the same meaning in Japanese.

[Brian Wolfe]

Hello Everyone,

Here's mine. The lighting in my collection room is not good for photography and the frame is just too heavy to take down so I apologize for the quality of the photo. The sources of glare are from the ceiling spot-lights and my poor old bald pate.

I purchased this probably 30 years ago at a local gun show where it was being used as a table cloth under a mix of hunting and military rifles. I was lucky that the fellow was not keen on any sort of oiling on the surface of the weapons and so the flag was not damaged. I had to pay a bit more to convince him to take all of the items off the flag but it was worth it (in my opinion).

Last weekend my sister-in-law who is from China was surprised to see the Japanese flag with what she, at first glance, thought was Chinese writing on it. This was the first time she has been in the collection room; I'm picky who I let in my collection room and since they have been married for three years now I figured the marrige has "taken". I was surprised that she could read a lot of the flag's Kanji though she cautioned that the meanings might not be 100% accurate. Some day I would like to get it translated.

As may show up in the photo mine has the corner reinforcement and what's left of the original strings.

Regards

Brian

[Tim B]

It's been several years since I used my Japanese while stationed in Yokosuka and today I couldn't tell you the differences between Kanji or Katakana.

I knew some guys that took classes and were able to read and write Japanese. What I understand is that the characters in Chinese and Japanese are very similar and IF you can read one, you are pretty much able to figure the other one out.

I do understand that translations are sometimes hard to figure 100% correctly, as the style is somewhat different "back then". Same can be said of German I guess when using terms from WWII. Also, as the Japanese were in China for so many years, many of the flags that have slogans from that area, are often slightly different than those elsewhere.

The flag that I have, which belonged to a man from central Tokyo and fought (and died) in China, was translated originally as:

盡忠報國, read じんちゅうほうこく, more commonly written in Japanese as 尽忠報国, with the basic meaning of "loyalty to one’s country is rewarded". However, after another collector at WAF told me, the Japanese would never mention a "reward" for loyality or service to the country (and emperor), which makes total sense. So, Nick correctly translated the meaning to "Absolute Loyalty and Service to the Nation" which is more in line to what you would expect, and similar to the SS moto of "My Honor is Loyalty".

Hope that helps a bit. I'll add a couple links that might help somewhat but, finding someone that can accuarately translate these flags is the better option IMO.

http://hk.dictionary.yahoo.com/search.html?s=%BA%C9%A9%BE%B3%F8%B0%EA

http://joechip.net/liana/archives/cat_japan.html

http://www.gethistorytoday.com/

Tim :beer:

[Tim B]

Brian,

Nice flag btw!

Thought I would toss up another PIC that I thought was interesting.

Tim