Franciscan monk with Egypt Medal?

[Odulf]

Gentlemen,

Today I received this strage CdV photo, of a Franciscan monk with Egypt Medal (no clasp) and Khedive's Star.

The photographer is the French N.Fettel & Cie in Alexandria (Egypt) and the phto dates from about 1885.

I am familiar with the British campaigns in Egypt and the Sudan, and the Egypt Medal. I know that the Army and Navy had their padres (I have had a small collection of Naval Chaplains' medals), but what about this character?

Can any of you enlighten me?

Edited December 17, 2010 by Odulf

[QSAMIKE]

Looking at his age there is a possibility that he became a Monk after he has done his service, maybe the cruelty of war made him turn to orders.......

Mike

[Odulf]

That is a possibility.

It is remarkable in that case that he is wearing his medals and had his picture taken in Alexandria.

Also funny, to see a medal (Khedive's Star) with Muslim symbols (half moon and star) on a Christian religious "uniform".

[Aberdeen Medals]

What a splendid and interesting picture

Do you have any further information - even a forename - to help narrow the search parameters here for a possible identifcation? I ask, as you mention the photograph is circa 1885 - is this because the picture is dated?

Five Franciscan nuns qualified for and were awarded the Egypt Medal with dated reverse 1882 (reference the medal roll WO 100/61) however on checking the medal roll all five names appear to be female.

As Mike has suggested it is also possible that the chap wearing the medals may well have earned in them in another capacity before taking holy orders, albeit if you do have a date for the picture then it's quite likely the medals are for service in the period 1884-1885!

A great number of 'local' residents (Arab, Greek, Coptic, Jewish, as well as expatriate Europeans) were employed in both the 1882 and especially later 1884-85 campaigns as 'Interepreters' and these would have been drawn from amongst all professions and perhaps including some of those in Holy Orders who were fluent in the local languages and dialects.

Yours aye,

Mark

[Aberdeen Medals]

Further to my earlier post, I have had a look again at the Egypt Medal Roll WO 100/61, and have now found a possible identified candidate for your Franciscan

The page immediately preceding the one that contains the details of the five Franciscan Nuns, has two names entered (one of which has subsequently been scored out) as being entitled to the Egypt Medal 1882 with no clasp. The names are shown as;

- Reverand Father Emmanuel Rennery (Sic) O.S.F.

- Reverand Father Patrick Duggan O.S.F.

The first name is scored out, and the surname could as likely be Remmery or such like - he appears not to have been issued a medal as only the second name which is un-marked has a note stating medal issued 3 October 1883 - the same medal isue date as the five nuns!

Presumbaly O.S.F. is an abbreviation for the Order of Saint Francis ?

As information.

Yours aye,

Mark

Edited April 14, 2011 by Aberdeen Medals

[Odulf]

Further to my earlier post, I have had a look again at the Egypt Medal Roll WO 100/61, and have now found a possible identified candidate for your Franciscan

The page immediately preceding the one that contains the details of the five Franciscan Nuns, has two names entered (one of which has subsequently been scored out) as being entitled to the Egypt Medal 1882 with no clasp. The names are shown as;

- Reverand Father Emmanuel Rennery (Sic) O.S.F.

- Reverand Father Patrick Duggan O.S.F.

The first name is scored out, and the surname could as likely be Remmery or such like - he appears not to have been issued a medal as only the second name which is un-marked has a note stating medal issued 3 October 1883 - the same medal isue date as the five nuns!

Presumbaly O.S.F. is an abbreviation for the Order of Saint Francis ?

As information.

Yours aye,

Mark

Thanks a lot Mark for your effords, very very interesting and much obliged!

OSF is translated as Order of St. Francis, or as Order of Servant Franciscans.

It is interesting to note that the photo was taken in Alexandria.

The name may indicate Irish origine, a breeding ground for Catholics for centuries.

Now, what was his "business" there?

The photo showed up in Holland, in an internet auction.

[Michael Johnson]

Died c. October 1883 at Cairo from cholera. "recently appointed acting military chaplain" From the Franciscan Annals:

http://books.google.ca/books?id=TSIQAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA320&lpg=PA320&dq=Fr.+%22patrick+duggan+osf%22&source=bl&ots=gWgWRzfmrq&sig=EWh6tTlf318ew7o4GWLtn82qaxk&hl=en&ei=qCKnTeCDCqTj0gGY09X5CA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBUQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Duggan&f=false

Fuller obituary here: http://books.google.ca/books?id=ijkFAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA716&lpg=PA716&dq=%22father+patrick+duggan%22&source=bl&ots=oXToBn4Sld&sig=ad4a2PomBCXe3A4eaJzCQbySJ9U&hl=en&ei=PSWnTfTfJsTG0QHw1eT5CA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CDcQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=%22father%20patrick%20duggan%22&f=false

Query how long would it take the medals to get out to Cairo?

Edited April 14, 2011 by Michael Johnson

[Odulf]

Died c. October 1883 at Cairo from cholera. "recently appointed acting military chaplain" From the Franciscan Annals:

http://books.google....=Duggan&f=false

Fuller obituary here: http://books.google....ggan%22&f=false

Query how long would it take the medals to get out to Cairo?

Thanks Michael!

If Farher Duggan died in about October 1883, his Eqypt Medal must have been the (dated) 1882 issue.

This medal was instituted in October 1882, and, obviously, the British Government lost no time in the production, naming and shipping of the medals to the Forces in Egypt; and neither did the Khedive.