Belgium Commemorative Medal 14/18 w/ Red Cross

[lambert]

Hello everyone.

I found this variation of the Commemorative Medal 14/18, very interesting. You know?

I think that is the Medical Corps or the Red Cross.

all the best

Lambert

[Tim B]

Hi Lambert,

Unless someone just placed a rather large cross to indicate a wound; perhaps a LARGE wound!

Here's the only Commemorative I have that has a red cross on it, along with the volunteer crown.

Tim :beer:

[lambert]

:lol: hahahah,

Perhaps a shell wound.

well, I contacted the seller who informed me that it could be an emblem Medical (paramedic or doctor) .. I still have doubts because I can not find it in official catalogs.

[belgoman]

hallo gents, the only official wound red cross is the one shown by Tim B.

Yet some holders found that it did not show enough that they were wounded and decided to put larger red crosses on the ribbon. As there are no "service bars" on the ribbon shown by Lambert, one can asume that the soldier got wounded in the very early days of the war and never got back to the front.

A single small cross on the ribbon would probably have been consider not glorious enough by the owner of the medal and so, it is just a guess, could have brought him to put a large red cross on the ribbon...

regards

[lambert]

Hi Belgoman

Thank you for letting your feelings.

regards

lambert

[belgoman]

Hi lambert, additional thoughts...

the kind of red cross I see on your ribbon is similar to the kind the members of the Belgian Red Cross had, between both WWs, on the collar tips of their uniform jacket. They then had a kaki uniform much alike the military ones...

But to be sure, we should have a picture of the back of the red cross (or at least a good description of it).

I think these crosses came into use about the 1925's...

If your medal is an original monted with this red cross one can assume that the owner received it after the "real fighters" got theirs (the medal was only instituted in 1919...) and took the liberty to choose for a "large" red cross...

regards,

belgoman

[lambert]

Hello Belgaman.

thank you for this information.

I will provide images of large cross back. are the same system used in the palms of the Combat Cross ..

lambert

[lambert]

This here.

[belgoman]

Hallo Lambert, this is indeed a Red Cross badge as I supposed.

I have been through my documentation and note that the uniformed members of the Belgian Red Cross wore this kind of cross on the collar tips, on the peaked cap... and the nurses did were they found it would fit (headdress, collar tips, brest pocket, aso) !!! and this since the late 1920's...

This kind of cross is still worn today.

I do not know from where you got the medal but I start to be afraid a seller ornate the ribbon with a large nowadays cross to make the medal more attractive. Sorry and hope I am wrong.

regards,

Belgoman

[RobW]

Hello Lambert,

Here is one of my navy war commemorative medals with a wound cross. It is different to that displayed by Tim B (post # 2) and has a very nice enamelled surface.

The single silver and gilt service bars surmounted by a Mothers Bar indicates service at the front that was ultimately cut short.

Regards,

Rob

[RobW]

Here is another that is part of a well-worn group of three. The service bars indicate a long period of service at the front, with the volunteers crown atop the bars. The volunteers gilt crown is larger than the original 6mm wide version authorised.

The wound cross is different again to the example of Tim B and the one in the above post.

The official decree instituting the award, of 21 July 1919, specified the red enamel cross to be 10mm. It does however appear that there were at least some form of variety in the crosses that were available at the time probably due to manufacturer variations.

The fact that this recipient has three wound crosses is at least indicative of the conditions at the front-line.

Regards,

Rob

Edited March 16, 2012 by RobW

[belgoman]

Hello Lambert, your medal tickled my curiosity and I went looking deeper and found that the comm. medal was also officially given to nurses (infirmières qui ont fait partie d'une formation sanitaire) that were part of a military sanitary organisation = say hospital . As no other devise figures on your ribbon and as your red cross is a typical original Red Cross one, one can state that your medal is a genuine medal for a nurse (that was probably a member of the Red Cross organisation). Seen the "freshness" of your medal, ribbon and cross, I suppose that the nurse did never wore it on her uniform and that the item rested in its box during years.

Congratulations. I was wrong and, believe me, glad I was.

[belgoman]

Hallo RobW, fine medals you show us from Australia, thanks.

Your medal nr1 :

As said before the only official red cross is the 10 mm one as seen in post 2. It exists with the red being red paint or red enamel (as the men had to buy their medals, the manufacturers proposed different qualities of crosses and... so different prices!)... and also as the years went by, the need of a 1st quality red cross reduced and the painted ones came.

As stated before, some manufacturers made red crosses that did not fit with the official norms (but no one was going to check it on the ribbons). You find the red crosses for the Red Cross organisation (see the medal shown by Lambert) but they also manufactured crosses to be worn on the lapel ribbons or service ribbons. Post 10 and post 11 are good examples of a service ribbon devise worn on a normal ribbon. But hondreds of Belgians had it this way and no autority ever said anything... So no problem to keep them in your collections... I have identical items in my collection.

Officially, the brass crossed anchors were introduced by royal decree of 3 november 1950 (yes 1950)... so I think that your sailor did not wait for it and still wanted to show he was a military sailor (the merchant marine ones had a single brass anchor of 10 mm high on the ribbon since 21/02/1921, the state marine sailors and fishers since 13/05/1936 ). He probably opted for crossed anchors foreseen for the service ribbon of the Décoration Maritime 1914 1918 (white enamelled cross)... as did the majority of the sailors then...

Normally the back mourning bar is supposed to be worn alone on the ribbon (with no other devices!).. but it is frequently seen with the devices the owner should have gained or had.

Regards, Belgoman

[belgoman]

Hallo RobW

now your medal nr 2 :

the crosses have allready been discussed and in this case the poor guy was wounded 3 times.

The gilted crown stands for a War Volunteer, normally 6 mm but often seen near the 10 mm... (once again, it had to be seen clearly on the ribbon...)

Fine medal, congratulations.

regards,

Belgoman

[lambert]

Hi Rob.

Thanks for posting your examples. I'll look for other types to complete this collection so significant, that I quite like.

Thank you.

Lambert

[lambert]

Belgoman.

I was very happy with their response.

It was exactly what I was told when I bought this medal (Medal of Victory also features the Red Cross), was informed that the Volutários belonged to the Army of the Red Cross during the Great War.

But I had doubts about it.

Lambert

[Gldank]

Here is one that I have had in my collection for many years. I am not sure about the number of bars but this is the way I received it from a Belgian friend.

[Gldank]

Here is another from my collection.

[Gldank]

Another

[Gldank]

Last one

[lambert]

Fine medals! It has a wide variety of ornaments on the Ribbon.

Lambert

[RobW]

Here is one that I have had in my collection for many years. I am not sure about the number of bars but this is the way I received it from a Belgian friend.

Hello James,

Thanks for your pics. What is the attachment at the top of this example?

Regards,

Rob

[Gldank]

It is just an attachment pin for attaching to the uniform or jacket.

[RobW]

Hello James,

Thanks for the clarification.

Given the wide variety of ribbon attachments for this medal I originally thought it may have been another attachment not previously seen.

Regards,

Rob