Organisational Badges 1st Pattern Frauenschaft badge

[Scowen]

Been a little quiet here so I thought I'd dig out a badge to show.

This is the 1st pattern Frauenschaft badge, believed to only have been in use for less than a year, 1933 - 1934.

Cheers

Don

[Scowen]

Reverse.

Anyone else have one to show?

Cheers

Don

[BURGERHAUS]

[attachmentid=22661][attachmentid=22662]

Reverse.

Anyone else have one to show?

Cheers

Don

Don, Here is mine to show. I do like the stamped markings. Robert

[Rosenberg]

Nice badge I never saw before.Is this the predecessor of those trapezoidal shaped Frauenschafts badges?

[BURGERHAUS]

[attachmentid=22682][attachmentid=22683]

Nice badge I never saw before.Is this the predecessor of those trapezoidal shaped Frauenschafts badges?

Yes, this is Type I. Here is type II. Hopefully Don will show a Type III. I have been trying to land one for awhile but many fakers out there. I have had to return the last 2 Type III's. Robert

[Scowen]

No type III here I'm afraid, haven't found one I'm happy with yet, although I'm hoping to receive a collection of enamels in a week or so, so here's hoping that there may be one in there.

In the meantime, back to the Type I. H?sken lists the ones at the top of this thread as Type I, 2nd form, so I suppose we could call it Type Ib. Below is what he calls Type I 1st form, so for ease of use, Type Ia. It's also shown as a drawing in the infamous article us Frauenschaft collectors know so well. (as another confusing point, both that article & H?sken show the Type Ib to have a beaded background to the red, not elongated flecks that we see here )

It doesn't appear as well made as the Type Ib & I'm not sure quite what to think of it, but I'll show it here anyway. I'm still looking for the Type Ic version (H?sken Type I 3rd form).

Cheers

Don

[Scowen]

rev

[BURGERHAUS]

rev

Don, Would you know offhand if Karl Henzler manufactured party pins as well as the type 1a Frauenschaft Badge? I ask because the beaded red enamel is the more common enamelling on party pins. Robert

[BURGERHAUS]

rev

Don, I also want to add that I like your 1a badge. Is that not a little smear of red enamel on the reverse? I have a DDAC and a RAD miniature like that as well. Robert

[BURGERHAUS]

rev

Don, I just looked Karl Henzler in Husken 1997. I see M1/6 Karl Hensler, Pforzheim. I would think the S in the spelling in the book and the Z on the badge would be a translation thing. Would I would like to see now is a M1/6 party pin. More research. A side note: After going over the RZM list......a find a woman maker....M1/87 Karoline Gehr, Munchen. I am suprised. Robert

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Don, I just looked Karl Henzler in Husken 1997. I see M1/6 Karl Hensler, Pforzheim. I would think the S in the spelling in the book and the Z on the badge would be a translation thing. Would I would like to see now is a M1/6 party pin. More research. A side note: After going over the RZM list......a find a woman maker....M1/87 Karoline Gehr, Munchen. I am suprised. Robert

Hello all,

It's my first post here - glad to find there is a haven for gentlemen collectors.

First of all, there are a couple of "women's" manufacturing companies in the RZM M1 list, like M1/148: "Heinrich Ulbrects Witwe, Wien". "Witwe" means widow, so the company is "Henirich Ulbrect's Widow, Vienna". I suppose that happened when the owner died and the wife takes over the business.

I have a few Frauenschafts to share. There is some discussion about the authenticity of certain Type III Leader Badges due to an article in Der Gauleiter a few years back, but I remain skeptical since no sources were offered, so they stay in the collection until proven otherwise.

Cheers,

Stephen

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Here's one of the Type III Keisleitung Leader badges that has been questioned.

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

And the back with the RZM maker code.

Cheers,

Stephen

[BURGERHAUS]

Hello all,

It's my first post here - glad to find there is a haven for gentlemen collectors.

First of all, there are a couple of "women's" manufacturing companies in the RZM M1 list, like M1/148: "Heinrich Ulbrects Witwe, Wien". "Witwe" means widow, so the company is "Henirich Ulbrect's Widow, Vienna". I suppose that happened when the owner died and the wife takes over the business.

I have a few Frauenschafts to share. There is some discussion about the authenticity of certain Type III Leader Badges due to an article in Der Gauleiter a few years back, but I remain skeptical since no sources were offered, so they stay in the collection until proven otherwise.

Cheers,

Stephen

Stephen, Nice collection there. I am glad you are here. Sorry about Herr Ulbrecht's widow. My oversight. If and when you would ever have the time and inclination, would it be possible to see the reverses of the 2 smaller standard Type IIs? Thanks alot. Robert

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Stephen, Nice collection there. I am glad you are here. Sorry about Herr Ulbrecht's widow. My oversight. If and when you would ever have the time and inclination, would it be possible to see the reverses of the 2 smaller standard Type IIs? Thanks alot. Robert

Hi Robert,

Happy to be here. Don't worry about Herr Ulbrecht's widow - I'm sure she's over it by now.

Here's one of the Type IIs. It is 21mm x 23mm in size. The RZM mark and code number without a M1 prefix means it was likely a Jan-March 1935 production piece.

Cheers,

Stephen

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Here's the other one from the same period - different maker. Size: 17mm x 20mm.

Cheers,

Stephen

[Scowen]

Hi Stephen, welcome.

Some nice pins there, I agree that we have to treat that article with caution, I'd like to see more research done to answer some of those questions once & for all. I worry that too many original items may be being trashed just because we are sometimes over cautious with them.

Robert,

I noticed the mis-spelling of the name as well. I don't know if it is a good badge or not, I do like it. In hand it is a little beauty, but time will tell I suppose. it is indeed a blob of red enamel on the reverse.

Cheers

Don

[Rosenberg]

I am also not sure what to think of the "Z" in Hensler.I saw other badges with HenSler.

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

A little bit of Frauenschaft trivia.

J.R. Cone in his book on enamels says no one knows what the "G-H-L" on these badges stands for. It is "Glaube, Hoffe, Liebe" or "Faith, Hope & Love", the motto of the NSF, taken from Paul's letter to the Corinthians, and often still referred to in modern marriage ceremonies.

By the way, here's my 1933 Osang Frauenschaft badge.

Cheers,

Stephen

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Just thought I'd add the big sister to these Type 2 badges. I don't have my ruler handy, but this is about three times the size of the smallest, and meant for wear as a broach, usually at the throat.

[Scowen]

Here's a crop from a picture I have showing this size badge in wear.

Cheers

Don

[Scowen]

When you look at the whole picture, there is a variety of sizes being worn, the smallest by the two women on the extreme right.

And check out those flags! I'd love one of those...... However, I'm not sure about Mickey Mouse in the back row

Cheers

Don

[BURGERHAUS]

Just thought I'd add the big sister to these Type 2 badges. I don't have my ruler handy, but this is about three times the size of the smallest, and meant for wear as a broach, usually at the throat.

Stephen, On the Type II standard badges, do you happen to have 9118G in Husken's book? The one I posted is that badge. Measurements are 21.5mm x 21.5mm. If you do and have the time and inclination could you post an image of its' reverse please? Also, with all the confusion with regard to Frauenschaft badges in general, what points of reference do use to determine originality? Since reverse markings seem to be up-in-the-air is it an in-the-hand and feel judgement? Take care and thank you. Robert

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

Stephen, On the Type II standard badges, do you happen to have 9118G in Husken's book? The one I posted is that badge. Measurements are 21.5mm x 21.5mm. If you do and have the time and inclination could you post an image of its' reverse please? Also, with all the confusion with regard to Frauenschaft badges in general, what points of reference do use to determine originality? Since reverse markings seem to be up-in-the-air is it an in-the-hand and feel judgement? Take care and thank you. Robert

Hi Robert -

I'll have a look at my Husken when I get home (which editon is the number from, since they changed with the new one?).

Some of it is feel, unfortunately. Fakes I have seen are usually flatter, with originals being slightly domed. The rest is the usual materials, finish and pin attachment. I've seen a lot of blue bordered Type II fakes. They usually have a floppy pin. J.R. Cone's book on TR enamels is a good starting point.

I'll get back about the Husken reference.

By the way, here's a photo of an NSF shoe depot in Berlin in 1940. Note the wall plaque!

[Gold Party Pin Guy]

As we're tlking about the NSF, here's a little bio and photo of Reichsfrauen-Fuhrerin Gertrud Scholtz-Klink:

Gertrud Scholtz-Klink joined the Nazi Party in 1928. Within two years, she headed the National Socialist Women's Union (NSF) in Baden. On January 1, 1934, Scholtz-Klink became Deputy Leader of the NSF. By November 1934, she headed all female groups within NSDAP, including the Frauenwerk, the Women's League of the Red Cross, the Women's Bureau in the Deutsche Arbeitsfront, and the Woman's Labor Service.

After eluding capture for nearly three years, on November 18, 1948, Scholtz-Klink was sentenced by a French military court to eighteen months imprisonment. In November 1949, the de-Nazification court branded Scholtz-Klink a "Major Offender". She died in 1999.

In the photo below she appears to be wearing the Gold Party Badge, Gold HJ Honour Badge and possibly the Studentenbund Honour Badge (but no NSF leader badge).