Request for forum Japanese Experts

[Rogi]

Specifically I've asked some of my friends to check this writing and see if it is a match to one another.

In short, it is on the box of one of my Serbian Order Rosette Boxes. It is in the set with that order that appears to have been awarded to a Japense recipient, but the writing of it really gives away a possible recipient. (no name of the recipient is listed in the box)

I've had my friend look over the Japanese archives and he has found the archival document from the recipient to wear this order.

On this box it reads "Serbia" (or Seruyiba in Japanese, I might not have spelled that properly)
in the archive document I've picked out 3 other places where it indicates the same from this recipients writing. I am no expert in Japanese characters (I'm not sure how easily it is to be consistent in the characters or how challenging it is to use certain inks etc), but it looks like a match to me.

Here is the box and later writing from the archive, I would request the members that take a look at this to comment, whether you believe it a match or not if you have a friend that is a Japanese Expert, would you please direct them to comment here with their opinion (I won't mention other facts just yet since they aren't relevent to the request for assistance) :

Here is the box:

And from the archival paper I have circled "Serbia" so you know what to look for

I've cropped the image on the rest and havn't circled it, but it should be easy to pick out:

final shot

What do you guys think, match, no match etc? (looking for if the writing on my box could be from the same recipient in terms of hand writing from the archive papers)

Any help and assistance is greatly appreciated Thank you all

Edited November 11, 2013 by Rogi

[JapanX]

I'd say a perfect match man!

[Rogi]

Thank you Nick, I see very little difference in the options so I hope other members agree too, but we'll see

[pieter1012]

Hi Rogi,

Nick asked me to look at the handwriting, and although I am no expert in Japanese characters, the way katakana is written in general is quite standard, although there are of course always small differerences in the way a person writes.

Looking at the way Serbia is written on the rosette box and the other documents I personally doubt whether it is written by the same person. The characters on the document are more curved, clearly distinguishable in the third and fourth character. Also, the third character "bi" has also almost dot like marks to denote the hi into bi on the document, whereas on the box the writer has made clear strokes.

Then again, the writer may have added Serbia on the box in haste, but took more care when writing the document.

Best regards,

Pieter

[Rogi]

Hi Rogi,

Nick asked me to look at the handwriting, and although I am no expert in Japanese characters, the way katakana is written in general is quite standard, although there are of course always small differerences in the way a person writes.

Looking at the way Serbia is written on the rosette box and the other documents I personally doubt whether it is written by the same person. The characters on the document are more curved, clearly distinguishable in the third and fourth character. Also, the third character "bi" has also almost dot like marks to denote the hi into bi on the document, whereas on the box the writer has made clear strokes.

Then again, the writer may have added Serbia on the box in haste, but took more care when writing the document.

Best regards,

Pieter

Thank you Pieter

One thing which is odd to me is the difference in each writing from the document to the box, each have little differences from each other. If he was more consistent in the document, it is still off in a sense.

When you compare just the writing in the document from the archive itself none of them share the exact same way it is written. For example if you take a look at the third character, it is joined in the first circled example while the other two have a small "space" at the connecting point. The size of the first line in the character also differs. The dots themselves are also situated in different sections. In other parts of the archival photo there are similar dots (starting very thin and expanding) to the dots in the box.

As for the 4th character, they all share differences as well, if you look at the last example, it is the closest to the box and shares very little difference. The tip of the 4th character on the box itself looks like the ink had run off a little, if you cover one portion where it has run off, it is nearly the same.

The only doubt I have is for the 3rd character but since he is inconsistent in each application of it in the archival document, I wouldn't be surprised if each version of his writing this character is different. As well to note, if you look at the curve, he has the same curve in character 1, but on the 3rd the bottom line is thicker, more pooling of ink maybe? The size of the box might also come into play since it is fairly small. The smallest section in the document itself from the archive is #2 picture.

How consistent can one be in these writing format? Does ink play any factor to the difference?

Edited November 11, 2013 by Rogi

[JapanX]

Ok.

Here we have Emperor Meiji signatures from three different documents for Golden Kite Order that bear same date April 1, 1906

[JapanX]

Any more questions

[Rogi]

Wow, they do look different so there is always hope for different style of writing

Thank you Nick for finding these

[JapanX]

It wasn't that hard.

All three is currently in my collection