Calling Rick

[TerryG]

The latest arrival in my collection. EK2, Hindenburg with swords..... I need some help as usual....Thanks :cheers:

Edited July 31, 2008 by TerryG

[Guest Rick Research]

:Cat-Scratch: HOLY BATCRAP !!!!!!!!

Zoooooom in on that ribbon bar!

In second place is some grade of award from the Principality of Hohenzollern from WW1 with Xs. Might have a better idea what if

A) he obligingly wrote his name on back (thanks to Mike Dunn, I have a complete list of every single native Hohenzollerner who served in WW1 ) or

B) the plain ribbons in the middle can be ID'd closer up.

3) Hindenburg X

4) ?

5) ?

6) ?

7) DANISH Medal for a variety of things (red with white center stripe and white horizontal funny looking stripe) but perhaps most likely the "Royal Medal of Recompense" weird weird weird weird WEIRD

8) ?

9) Austrian WW1 Commemoraative Medal X

10) Hungarian WW1 Commemorative medal X

He is also wearing a strange version of the under the shoulder straps bars indicating that he is attired as a "Leutnant a.D."-- a RETIRED Leutnant.

From the helmet, I'd take this to be 1939-40, though the ribbon bar is 1934-38.

[TerryG]

Thanks for all that so far. No name on the back. Just the name of the photographer.

Retired?

Edited July 31, 2008 by TerryG

[Guest Rick Research]

Yup, yup. Identified ribbons confirmed.

DANISH!!!!!

4) & 5) are possibly Prussian long service and an 1897 Medal--though he does not look THAT old.

Can't tell if 6) is solid or striped and just showing moir? pattern.

8) is too washed out to guess.

MAYBE if the photographer was in Hohenzollern, he can be ID'd. Awards are listed in the Home Boys Who Went To War volume.

The passants (under the board fore-and-aft) are normally bigger and only 1 not two, but can't be anything else. It was a visual indication that he was a "Leutnant a.D." and not a Leutnant d.R. etc etc.

That also appears to reinforce a retired Imperial career NCO who went out in 1920 with that rank as a pension bump (18 years of service, with 1914-18 counted as 10) and has just been called back up for the Second War.

[Great Dane]

Interesting indeed!

I doubt the Danish ribbon is for the Medal of Recompense (he isn't the sort of guy these were awarded to...), but as you say it can be for a variety of things (we're not very original when it comes to ribbons )

My guess would be one of the life saving medals (Noble Deeds or Saving Life from Drowning) or - a wild guess - King Frederik VIIIs Memorial Medal (the King died in hamburg in 1912 and the medal was awarded to those that helped in 'shipping' him back to Denmark).

Fascinating!

/Mike

[Guest Rick Research]

Ayuh. I've got Per Thornit's "The Royal Commemorative and Coronation Medals of Scandanavia 1892-1982" (because I have always been eclectic, even then) and considered that...

but there wouldn't seem any reason for an NCO from Hohenzollern to have been in Travem?nde in 1912, either. 67 awarded... but the list is not given.

What was the photographer's town? That's our last hope from a home town angle.

Because this guy had a SERIOUSLY WEIRD career.

Blowing up your ribbon bar closeup (which makes it fuzzier, alas, from my end) I am now fairly certain:

4) Prussian Long Service award (probably XXV in 1920)

5) 1897 (he does NOT look 60+ does he?)

6) I am now sure IS striped, and matching colors with #4, I think this is most likely a Silver or Bronze Medal of the Bavarian Order of Saint Michael.

8) is tucked away in the midst of the "foreign" stuff, so I'll take it as that. Either a Swedish Medal (?) of the Order of the Sword, or perhaps a Bulgarian WW1 bravery award ribbon-- though I doubt that with no device on it.

Verrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry strange career.

In fact, it now strikes me as MORE likely that rather than a native Hohenzollerner (we should be so lucky) he was perhaps more probably an NCO in the Prussian 2nd Foot Guards. That regiment was liberally awarded Hohenzollern wartime awards and seems to have had a number of officers with Danish and Swedish or Bavarian awards pre-war.

[TerryG]

Well, many thanks for all this attention! This was picked up recently in a Berlin flea market.

Markings at the back read: "Photogr. j.Kindermann, ....(obscured by glued black paper torn off from the original album I assume)....O., Wilhelmsplatz 2"

I have had another go at a close up scan....best I can do

Edited August 1, 2008 by TerryG

[Great Dane]

I don't think #5 is the 1897 medal - that yellow ribbon normally comes out very dark on b/w photos from the period.

I don't have any other suggestions though...

/Mike

[Guest Rick Research]

I'd agree from circa 1914 "spectrum shifts" but this one must have been taken about 1940.

That's the problem with plain solid color ribbons, always.

I doubt he was old enough to have been serving in 1897 too... which leaves us with any of ???? possible solid color German (from the ribbon) pre-1914 house order type junior awards.

That Danish ribbon and the "a.D." passants are the prizes.

It's a crying shame no name was written, since that's either a Silver Merit Cross X or a Gold Merit Medal of Hohenzollern's house order Honor Cross... and the rolls are done (and now published ) for those. :banger:

[Great Dane]

I was playing with the thought that #5, 6, 7 and 8 were all foreign (i.e. non-german) medals/orders, which would indicate some sort of diplomatic career, but it doesn't really make sense... surely he would have received the Order of Dannebrog instead of a Danish medal for that (and probably German orders as well).

/Mike

[Paul R]

That Danish ribbon and the "a.D." passants are the prizes.

Here are some retired officer straps for comparision.

Now, why did the a.D. officers wear the two separated passants? I thought that they simply had the orange-red waffenfarbe.

[Paul R]

back

[Paul R]

Here are some retired officer straps for comparision.

Now, why did the a.D. officers wear the two separated passants? I thought that they simply had the orange-red waffenfarbe.

Anyone?

[Guest Rick Research]

Orrrr rather..... why would they have orange-red underlay in place of their correct branch color with the easy to fit on passants?