Württemberg Friedrich Order 1st Class?

[P.F.]

Gentlemen,

I have just purchased this 2-place ribbon bar. Do the gilded swords represent a 1st Class Friedrich Order? If so would there not be more awards on this bar? The bar itself seems 100% construction-wise so not doubting its originality....just curious about the swords!

My thanks

Pierce

[P.F.]

Another view.

[Wild Card]

Perhaps a Prussian Crown Order 4th class with swords?

[Wild Card]

:whistle:

Perhaps a Prussian Crown Order 4th class with swords?

Wrong ribbon!

Sorry.

P.S. Did anyone else ever notice the illustration

for the Crown Order 4th class w/swds in the

Magnum Opus? :unsure:

[saschaw]

I may be wrong but think this order's swords are always gold, so this can be either class. However, a sole WF3aX might be possible. More likely, of course, a WF3bX.

P.S. Did anyone else ever notice the illustration

for the Crown Order 4th class w/swds in the

Magnum Opus?

I didn't. Is there one on "statutenmäßigem Band"? Those might exist - awarded to foreigners! Unlikely here...

[Wild Card]

Of course the picture is black and white,but from what I can tell, it is the standard blue ribbon.

I would definitely go with the Württemberg Friedrich 3rd or 4th.

[P.F.]

I may be wrong but think this order's swords are always gold, so this can be either class. However, a sole WF3aX might be possible. More likely, of course, a WF3bX.

Firstly my thanks to Wildcard and Saschaw for replying.

Here is another bar i have with Friedrich Order with Silver Swords...making it a 2nd class?

From what you both say i am going to assume there are lower grades of the Friedrich Order? Does anyone have pictures?

Many thanks

Pierce

[Beau Newman]

A 2nd Class Group:

[Beau Newman]

And a 1st Class Group:

Both have gold swords.

[P.F.]

Thanks Beau! These are beautiful medal bars!!

Anyone got pictures of the 3rd and 4th class?

Thanks

Pierce

[Beau Newman]

Anyone got pictures of the 3rd and 4th class?

Thanks

Pierce

The only lower grade was the Golden Merit Medal. There were Commanders and Grand Cross Grades above the 1st & 2nd Class Knights.

[P.F.]

The only lower grade was the Golden Merit Medal. There were Commanders and Grand Cross Grades above the 1st & 2nd Class Knights.

Ah yes, now i know about the higher grades but not the lower grades beyond 2nd class...Ok...confused....so what are Saschaw and Wild Card talking about 3rd and 4th?

Kind regards

Pierce

Edited May 13, 2010 by P.F.

[Beau Newman]

In the abbreviated nomenclature, the Grand Cross is 1, Commander is 2, Knight 1st Class is 3 and Knight 2nd Class is 4. This lines up with the Prussian system (such as the Red Eagle and Crown Orders) in which the classes were designated 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th instead of Grand Cross, Commander's, Knight 1st and Knight 2nd. There is a good explanation on the shorthand near the top of this category.

[P.F.]

In the abbreviated nomenclature, the Grand Cross is 1, Commander is 2, Knight 1st Class is 3 and Knight 2nd Class is 4. This lines up with the Prussian system (such as the Red Eagle and Crown Orders) in which the classes were designated 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th instead of Grand Cross, Commander's, Knight 1st and Knight 2nd. There is a good explanation on the shorthand near the top of this category.

Ahhh...now i understand. Please pardon my ignorance gentlemen.

Best regards

Pierce

[P.F.]

And another i have in the collection...with guilded swords!

Pierce

[saschaw]

We were and are talking about knight's cross 1st and 2nd class of this order (WF3aX and WF3bX in Prussian rank lists).

Gilt swords do not indicate anything here as the order always had gold swords. Silver swords however must be for (Leutnant/Oberleutnant level) knight's cross 2nd class. That device is actually wrong but makes the classes clearer.

[P.F.]

We were and are talking about knight's cross 1st and 2nd class of this order (WF3aX and WF3bX in Prussian rank lists).

Gilt swords do not indicate anything here as the order always had gold swords. Silver swords however must be for (Leutnant/Oberleutnant level) knight's cross 2nd class. That device is actually wrong but makes the classes clearer.

Thank you for this extra piece of useful information Saschaw.

Kind regards

Pierce