Gordon Williamson

Yes, that sort of thing. Even closer , like this if possible. I guess the little white circle was to look for the flaw on the 3. You won't find it on the one without Swords, only on the one with Swords. With Swords and without Swords came from different dies.

Does anyone have any of the propaganda postcards which featured awards and decorations ( usually on a red background) I know they did the KVK series and have been looking around for them. Seen a few with the EKs, Spanish Crosses etc but no KVKs. Nothings ever there when you look for it though !

The "with Swords" looks like it was a real beauty before the finish started to go.

Laurence, Lothar Kreuz was a Generalarzt, a high ranking Army surgeon, who was also rector of Berlin University. He got the award for his resarch into prosthetic limbs for wounded/disabled servicemen. He survived the war, remained in medicine, and was also decorated by the West German government with the Grossen Bundesverdienstkreuz Here is another photo of him.

If you look at the hinge on the 43 marked piece, it is set a mm or two down front the "notch" in the top arm. On the unmarked ones, both yours and mine, the hinge is set as far up as it can go, right to the edge. If you allow for this, the difference in length isn't really significant. My money would still be on them being unmarked 43 unless we can find another closer match.

Especially when it has the firm's logo as well as the number.

W&L Crosses are in my opinion one of the finest that can be found, they certainly put over-rated makers like Juncker in the shade. The other maker I think also produces some of the finest material is S&L. Normally I am no great fan of private purchase (LDO) stuff, but I could never resist a frosty Steinhauer.

If they were realy "favoured", they might get the award personally from Hitler.

The award ceremonies were often held in large public auditoriums and the awards made "en masse", a bit like graduation day at a university, with all the recipients taking their turn on stage to be handed their awards. There were usually "honour guards" from the military, always Ritterkreuztr?ger, to show the solidarity between those recieving thier awards for services on the home front, and those who were decorated for achievements "in the field" Here, my friend Hein Springer from the Leibstandarte is one of the honour guards for the award to Franz Hahne

Laurence, yours is a very fine textbook original example. You should be very pleased with it. The absolute vast majority of these went to non-military persons such as industrialists etc. There were only a tiny number to military guys. Here is one, General Kreuz.

The one I posted earlier was a Steinhauer, here is the Deschler. There are quite a few differences in die characteristics, especially the reverse where the numerals are distictly different between the two makers.

Jim, I try to keep an open mind on most things, but if I was going to buy one of these, my own preference would be for the type you have. For me yours is the perfect textbook example.

I have the identical twin to this piece, also in the identical box (with rectangular push button) and for me, am pretty sure its an unmarked "43". The L/11 pin tapers more towards the point and is shorter, but these unmarked pieces have pins which are identical to the 43. I've also compared the obverse details to the "43" and they are identical. Here's mine.

Clamshell screwback KVK1. These can be tricky as Floch made Clamshell versions of his fake KVK1. The Floch pieces have certain distinctive characteristics though, so its possible to tell an unmarked original like this from a Floch.

Laurence, Thought you might like to see this one.

Nick, Don't beat yourself up about it, this type is also faked ( in both First Class and Second Class) and in the circumstances you describe,amongst a whole load of dodgy bits, the one you saw may well have been a duff one. One good thing to look for on these ( and also on the regular round 3 types) is the dimpled finish under the paint. Jim's is absolutely textbook.

I don't think its necessarily any more dangerous than other areas of collecting. There are fake , ( or re-named) British medals that would fool the unwary, and no shortage of re-strikes of the rarer British Regimental Cap Badges. If you specialise and really study your subject, I don't think German stuff is so much more risky than any other, but you really do have to specialise.

Very nice photo. Shots of the "Nichtk?mpferband" being worn are hard to find. On the Iron Cross, very unlikely that it will ever be awarded again. It is technically a "temporary" award which has to be re-instituted each time the country goes to war, then falls into abeyance in peacetime. So, it would only every be re-introduced if Germany went to war again. Highly unlikely. (War in this case being a declared state of war, so e.g. German troops serving with Nato peacekeeping forcves etc wouldn't qualify anyway.)

Jim, Although I think these are just about the ugliest EKs around, they are extremely rare and you have got yourself a very fine example. Congratulations.

Dave, that W&L EK1 is a stunner ! and Jim, that cased EK2 is one of the nicest I have seen, with what has to be one of the rarest known markings ( as far as position is concerned). A real treasure !