David M

Hi Carol, I found the details on this site, and coulnt understand why a Hofmarschall would get an order for mining, agriculture aso....is there a list of rolls published on the Vasa-order? David

Hi Glenn, as my research progresses, I found some other senoir prussian officers and wondered if they would be in your book as well, again looking for career data, pictures and possible dates of the (foreign)awards: Wilhelm von Kienitz, geboren M?nster 23.03.1823 D70/71, OldV2bXaR, PrRa2mE, PrKr2, EK2, PrDK, Pr66, PrZM Adolf von Herzberg, D70/71, Ludwigsorden2a, HssP2b, MecklWKr2a, McklSchwMVK1, OldV2bX, PrRA2mSt&E&XaR, PrRA2mSch&Xor, PrKr1mXaR, PrKr3X, EK1, PrDK, Pr64, Pr66, PrZM, WldVK1, WrtF1 OestEK3X, RussSt1 Friedrich Graf von Perponcher-Sedlnitzky, AnhA1 BVKO1 BayMich1 BdZL1mBr BdZL1XmgoldeneKtt BrnL1 D70/71 HanG3 HssP1 HohEK1 LpEK1 MecklWkr1mgKr MecklSchMVD2 OldV1 PrRAGKmE&Kr PrRAmEmEdKrXaR PrKr2X PrHoh1 EKII PrLD1 Pr66 PrZM KsaA1msSt GsaF1 HSaH1 SchLpMvM WldMVK1 WrtF1 BlgL1 DuD1 GrchE1 JapV1 LtM&L1 TosCiv1 NdL1 OestL1 OestEK1 OestFJ1 PersL&S1 PrtChr1 PrtV1 RMSt1 RussAletc RussA1mBr SchwdN1 SpCIII SrbT1 TuerO1 TuerM1. Thanks again, David

Then why did Friedrich Wilhelm Julius Georg Alexander Joseph Ernst Freiherr von Verschuer (Annahme des kurf?rstlich hessischen Freiherrntitels 1839 f?r diese Familie mit niederl?ndischen Adelstitel), geboren Fritzlar 1827, gestorben Salzburg 1902; 1846 Secondelieutenant, reichte 1850 keinen Abschied ein, 1852 Premierlieutenant, 1858 Rittmeister, 1859-1866 Fl?geladjutant des Kurf?rsten, 1861 Kommandeur der Garde-Gendarmerie zu Pferde, 1866 w?rde er von der ?bernahme in die preu?ischen Armee ausgeschlossen, trat in den unmittelbaren Diensten des Kurf?rsten und ging mit Friedrich Wilhelm I. ins Exil. Er diente vor?bergehend 1866-1872 als Hofmarschall. ?FJ-2, GHPO-2X, SW-C, DD-3, HG-3X. Arndt S. 491; Rosenwald, Offiziere Nr. 312 S. 57. get it as well? Any ideas or similar examples?

That's to bad

Hi Glenn That is an interesting title!!! is it set-up by country and does it also contain the last kurhessian Generals 1848-1866 like Schirmer, Kaltenborn and R?ppell von Helmschwerdt? David

I think so to, I saw pictures of the ceremonie before and recognize the setting...

Hi Glenn Thanks for the info and beautiful picture. What was the source for the pictures? David

Hi Gents I am looking for data on the career of the sachson officer Alban von Montbe. Over the internet I could ifnd out he was Stadtkommandant of Dresden 1874-1885. He also held the Inhaberkreuz (=4th Class) of the Wilhelmsorden, that's why I am interested in the 1st place. A picture would be great too Thanks a lot David M

HI Gents as you may or may not know I am describing the kurhessian Wilhelmsorden as one of my projects at the moment. I would like to make the entry of Dimitri von Vietinghoff complete, but do not have the DOA 1908-1909 to check his awards. I hope someone could assist me in this This is what I have so far (thanks to Glenn J) I would also like to fill in some gaps in his career (regiments names at Artillerie aso) and find full dates where I just have years now Dimitri von Vietinghoff, geboren Ludwigslust 21.05.1836, gestorben 24.10.1914;1854 Offizier-Aspirant ins J?ger-Bataillon, 19.12.1855 Secondelieutenant und Versetzung zur Artillerie, 05.10.1860 Premierlieutenant, 1863 Fl?geladjutant des Grossherzogen, 30.10.1866 Hauptmann, 1872 Kommandeur einer Batterie im Feld-Artillerie-Regiment Nr. 6, 1875 Major ins 1. Garde-Feld-Artillerie Regiment, 1876-25.03.1882 kaiserlich deutscher Milit?r Attache an der Gesandschaft in London, 16.09.1881 Oberstlieutenant, 1883 Oberst a.D.und Hofmarschall der Grossherzogin-Mutter Alexandrine von Mecklenburg-Schwerin, 1892 Oberschlosshauptmann des Grossherzogen Friedrich Franz III., 1895 Excellenz, 12.12.1903 Hofmarschall, Thanks a lot David M

Hi Rick that is really a great addition!!! Any idea when the Lippe-D's will be available in print? David

Hi Mike How would I do that? If someone could help me out by downloading it and mailing to my gmail account.....that would be veeeeeery helpfull

As you understand, I would be most interested in the Kurhessian Stammliste 16th-1866!!

Am I doing something wrong? I can only find fragments and not download the entire book.... probably just me... David

Would anyone know about the Hannover rolls for their awards?Are they still out there or do we rely on the STB? David

Hi Werner I can only imagine what a vast files you must have on your computer. Did you ever consider publishing? As far as the Anhalt Bear Order is concerned, I do hope that there will be a volunteer who will take the responsibility form the pre 1872 awards. Would they also be in the Staatshandb?cher? As I understand correctly, the Bear Order was established 1834 as a follow-up of a previous bear order. It would be really great to have all the data in one publication! Would anyone know when this bear order originally started? forgive me for getting all exited about this, I just love pre 1871 orders and would most certainly volunteer myself for doing the rest of the bear order (pre 1872) if a publications should not be hasted..... I would really love to see how my first project (HGL) turns out before I make any commitments to other pre 1871 orders David

1. Anhalt a.-1912 ? what, since when  Werner Nickel 2. Baden a.KFO/BZL: published, but incomplete -1914, what, since when  Werner Nickel 3. Bayern a.MMJO: published b.MVO/MVK: published, but incomplete foreign awards to Bavarian officers -1917  Werner Nickel The Bavarian MVO/MVK is done all civilian awards 1866 until the end. War decorations completely 1866 - 1914. Also all war decorations MVO third class upwards until the end. Fourth class with crown and swords all Bavarians. MVK 1. Cl with swords partly, crown and swords all. 4. Braunschweig: a.BrH/BrEAK: apparently not in archive -1914, what, since when  Werner Nickel 5. Bremen a.Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published 6. Hamburg a.Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published 7. Hessen-Darmstadt a.HPO/HT: destroyed in the war? 8. Hessen (Kurf?rstentum): a.House Order of the Golden Lion --> David M b.Order of William --> David M 9. Hohenzollern a.Ehrenkreuz all classes, with X, gold medals, done Silver medals x to non Prussians, done 10. Lippe-Detmold a.LDH: 1869-1939 down to silver merit cross: all grades are done Leopold order down to Bronze medals: done Rose order all classes: done Kriegervereinkreuz: done Merit medals, to be done Bertha Order: done Frauenverdienstkreuz: done Frauenverdienstmedals, done Silver Civil Merit Medal on Ribbon aka "Paulinen Medal," 1817-1918: done 11. L?beck a.Hanseatenkreuz: exist in archive, not yet published, though 30% done  Bernd D. 12. Mecklenburg-Schwerin a.exist in archive, not yet published 13. Mecklenburg-Strelitz a.found, but too chaotic to be useful, and fragmentary rolls far from complete 14. Oldenburg a.-1914, what, since when  Werner Nickel 15. Preu?en a.PLM/HHOX: published Verdienstkreuz f?r Frauen und Jungfrauen will be published online in may 2007 Milit?rehrenzeich 1867-1913  Werner Nickel 16. Reu? ?.L. und j.L. a.exist in archive, not yet published 17. Sachsen a.SH/SV: published b.SA: published, but rolls not complete Maria Anna no priority, Rick R. has the rolls 18. Sachsen-Altenburg a.HSH: Altenburg published published, being redone to match other two 19. Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha a.HSH: being published b.Carl Eduard War Cross: being published c.Carl Eduard Medals: being published 20. Sachsen-Meiningen a.HSH: being published, but incomplete b.War Merit Cross: being published 21. Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach a.WF: being published, but incomplete b.Wilhelm Ernst War Cros: being published c. General Decorations in Gold & Silver 1914-1919 with Xs: being published 22. Schaumburg-Lippe a.Ehrenkreuz down to silver merit cross from 1890 onwards, will be done 23. Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt und Schwarzburg-Sondershausen a.exist in archive, not yet published 24. Waldeck a.Merit Cross 1914-18: published The rest is a real mess, though rolls exist for: Merit Order 1 2 3 1857-1896 Officers grade 1912-1918 Merit Medal Gold 1891-1917 25. W?rttemberg a.WKO/MVO/WF: being published 26. Austria a.Iron Crown: ? b.?MK: ?

Hi Werner when you mention Anhalt until 1912, do you mean all Anhalt from the beginning (say 1834 for the Bear-order)? For Oldenburg, I know the guy from the oldenburg orders site is doing a list as well, did you cooperate with him? Did you do every class for the Red Eagle Order? from when? hope to hear from you again David

Thanks wild card, that's the kind of info we need in this thread!! good to hear the MVO and MVKs are covered!! Will make a summary of the info we have so far when I have time, which will probably not be today. all the best David

Well I just hope then that the Staatshandbuch from Baden kept lists with dates just like the Kurhessen and Grandducal Hessen did. Will contact them about that sometime in the future.

Although replying to myself here, I would like your advice on a matter that has been bothering me. from what I know, Rick Research makes his lists as in this thread: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=14821 however, this is the way I am making the entries in the publication on the HGL. I take them word-by-word from th Staatshandbuch: 25.08.1777 Ihro Excellenz der Herr Ober-J?germeister von Spiegel, Date first, then function and name as last entry. In this way most of the context is preserved. What is the difference in value here for researchers? David M

Regarding elder rolls which have already been published, would it not be an idea to just make a file in pdf-format and place it on a internetsite? This because we do know the rolls are there, it apperantly would not be to much of an effort typing them over (39 pages) and they are hard to come by these days I guess..... Should anyone have these, I would be most happy to put them on my site, which I m currently rescheduling. I am also working on the lists of some Frankfurt awards to be put online in that fashion. Thanks for any comments on this idea, David M

Hi Red Eagle do you have the full bibliographical data forthis publication?

@ Rick I am guessing that you are just doing the BZL for WWI. As the order was erected in 1812 according to Dave Danners site, do you know if the rest of the rolls is still there as well? If not, I will contact the Baden myself to find out. David

Of all the Hansa rolls?

One of us had the idea of setting up a fixed thread listing the existing rolls and the several projects we are working on. Why not start with each and every single one project listing and summarizing every once in a while, I think alphabeticlly on countryname would be a good idea? I just added from the top of my head, and added the name of the people working on them.... Bremen (Hanseatenstadt): Hanseatic Cross Hamburg (Hanseatenstadt): Hanseatic cross Hessen (Kurf?rstentum): House Order of the Golden Lion --> David M Hessen (Kurf?rstentum): Order of William --> David M L?beck (Hanseatenstadt): Hanseatic Cross Reuss ?.L. (F?rstentum): Honor Cross Reuss j.L. (F?rstentum): Honor Cross I?d see keep them coming David