gerardkenny

Last couple of pics :

Taken with a phone so the quality is not great:

As mentioned on this thread : http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/24625-irish-1916-21-medal-collection-on-ebay/page__st__200 There were many interesting lots. http://www.whytes.com/AuctionPDFs/Addenda20110416.pdf THE FOLLOWING LOTS ARE WITHDRAWN FROM THE SALE: 26, 85, 86, 138,186, 394, 494, 502A, 514A, 515A, 598, 601, 608, 609, 610, 613, 615, 617, 621 We are pleased to announce that we have purchased lot 186 from the consignor and donated it to the Women’s Section (Dún Laoghaire), South County Dublin Branch, Royal British Legion. Lots 598, 608, 609, 613, 615 , 617 and 621 were duplicate entries in error of other lots in the sale. This lot was withdrawn on request of the Irish Govt : 138 1900 (26 April). Office of Public Works file on the visit of Queen Victoria and arrangements for her arrival at Kingstown (Dun Laoghaire) manuscript and typescript, various sizes, pp200 approx. Extremely detailed arrangements for the Queen’s arrival, with correspondence to and from various government officials, regarding various works to be completed at the harbour, the size of the Royal railway train, decorations, illuminations, and protocol down to what type of coat to wear. Fascinating record that may be of use again when Victoria’s great grand daughter visits Dublin in May, though she will not disembark from the Holyhead ferry on this occasion. €400-€600 (£350-£520 approx.) Here is the list of prices : http://www.whytes.com/AuctionPDFs/20110416PR.pdf Lot 241 (mentioned in the thread above) doesn't seem to be on this list for some reason. Here are some pics from the whytes collection shop across the road from the freemason hall where the auction was held (a stonesthrow from Dail Eireann) - mainly showing lot 291 : 291 1920-1921: Auxiliary Division uniform including tunic, cap, bandolier and Webley revolver. Auxiliary Division of the Royal Irish Constabulary uniform including balmoral beret made by R. A. Knight dated June 1916 complete with cap badge on square khaki backing, other ranks British WW1 period tunic with general service buttons and collar badges, black trousers, leather gaiters, black leather sam browne belt complete with handcuff case and revolver holster, black leather bandolier and Mark IV Webley service revolver, serial number “125001”. The Auxiliary Division Royal Irish Constabulary (ADRIC) was founded in July 1920 and by November 1921 the division was 1,900 strong. The Auxiliaries were part of the RIC, but operated more or less independently of the police force in a number of rural areas. Divided into companies, each about one hundred strong, they were heavily armed and highly mobile in an attempt to combat the IRA flying columns. They operated in ten counties, mostly in the south and west, where IRA activity was greatest. The uniforms that they wore, such as this example, were usually a mix between RIC uniforms or old army uniforms with appropriate police badges, along with the distinctive Tam-o-shanter or balmoral caps. The cap accompanying this uniform bears a badge similar to that used by K Company of the Auxiliaries based in Moore’s Hotel, Cork City (as illustrated on page 278 of Tudor’s Toughs by Ernest McCall) (8 items)€5,000-€7,000 (£4,400-£6,100 approx.)

Forgot to mention I believe there was also a 'Lot 241a' which was not in the calalogue, I believe it was a War of Independence with Comrac and a 1916 - can't remember for sure. When Whytes upload the prices I am sure it will be in the list.

From what I recall Lot 241 went quite high, something in the €6-7K region. If I recall correctly the auctioneer said she was a hardline republican who refused her pension and medals etc from the Free State, the medals were later claimed by her surviving family.

Thanks for that.

I thouht this may be of interest to some here; The new Whytes April 2011 Auction catalogue has just been released : HISTORY, LITERATURE & COLLECTIBLES Saturday 16 April 2011 at 1pm Historical manuscripts, documents, photographs and ephemera (Lots 1-392) 6 Literature, Drama & Music (Lots 393-436) 75 Sporting Memorabilia (Lots 437-467) 80 Coins (Lots 468-522) 84 Banknotes (Lots 523-628) 89 Bid Form 100 http://www.whytes.com/AuctionPDFs/20110416.pdf There is also an online catalogue : http://whytes.com/i7.asp?Auction=20110416&Lot=1 The whytes auctioneers site has crashed a couple of times in the last 24 hours so the link may have issues from time to time. Personally I think the highlights would include : 41 1803. Robert Emmet’s Proclamation One of the rarest Irish revolutionary documents extant. “The Provisional Government TO THE PEOPLE OF IRELAND” letterpress, framed 53 by 44cm., 21 by 17.5in. Provenance: The Wolfe family, Forenaughts House, Co. Kildare, since 1803; The Estate of Miss Maud Wolfe, Forenaughts House; Sale by auction of the contents of Forenaughts House, Hamilton & Hamilton, 23 September 1980, whence acquired by the present owner. Theobald Wolfe of Forenaughts House was the godfather of Theobald Wolfe Tone, the son of Peter Tone, a coach builder who married a companion of Wolfe’s wife. It is interesting that the Wolfe family should have retained this seditious document, given that Arthur Wolfe, the first Baron Kilwarden, and first cousin of Theobald Wolfe, was, along with his nephew, killed by rebels during the insuurection of 1803. (see lot 40 in this sale). The last member of the Wolfe family to live at Forenaughts, was Emily Maud Wolfe, the daughter of Cumann na nGaedhal TD George Wolfe and proudly counted amongst her ancestors Theobald Wolfe Tone and the famous General James Wolfe who was killed during the Seven Year’s War. Up until her death on the 28th of April 1980 she regularly attended the Bodenstown commemorations Robert Emmet was born in Dublin in 1778. After attending Whyte’s Academy, in the company of Thomas Moore, Arthur Wellesley (later the Duke of Wellington) and Richard Brinsley Sheridan, , he entered Trinity College, Dublin in October 1793 and became involved in political activism. He was elected secretary to the secret United Irish Committee in the college, and was expelled in April 1798 as a result and fled to France to avoid the many arrests that were taking place in Ireland after the 1798 Rebellion. After his return to Ireland Emmet began to prepare for rebellion with fellow revolutionaries Thomas Russell and James Hope. Unlike in 1798, the preparations for the uprising were successfully concealed, but a premature explosion at one of Emmet’s arms depots killed a man and forced Emmet to bring forward the date of the rising before the authorities’ suspicions were aroused. As part of the preparations Emmet wrote this proclamation addressing it from “The Provisional Government to The People of Ireland”. It began by reiterating republican sentiments expressed during the previous rebellion and calling on the Irish population to claim their right to independence “You are now called on to show to the world that you are competent to take your place among nations, that you have a right to claim their recognisance of you, as an independent country ... We therefore solemnly declare, that our object is to establish a free and independent republic in Ireland: that the pursuit of this object we will relinquish only with our lives ... We war against no religious sect ... We war against English dominion.” The Proclamation not only served as a call to arms but also as an interim constitution and is remarkably forward thinking in terms of constitutional law. The lines “we will not imitate you in cruelty; we will put no man to death in cold blood, the prisoners which first fall into our hands shall be treated with the respect” predates the first Geneva Convention by 60 years, which is considered today as the basis on which rest the rules of international law for the protection of the victims of armed conflicts on the treatment of prisoners of war. Seán Ó Brádaigh, in his 2003 book recording the life of Emmet, Bold Robert Emmet, put forward his argument that the proclamation contains ‘a moral framework’ for those ‘unfortunate but sometimes necessary events in human life’. . Shortly after the rebellion began it disintegrated into little more than a riot, in stark contrast to the beliefs and ideals that Emmet displayed in the proclamation. Emmet was unable to secure the help of rebels from Wicklow under the command of United Irishmen leader Michael Dwyer and many rebels from Kildare who had arrived to help, turned back due to the lack of firearms they had been promised. Nonetheless the rising went ahead in Dublin on the evening of 23 July 1803. Failing to seize Dublin Castle, which was lightly defended, the rising amounted to a large-scale riot in the Thomas Street area. Emmet personally witnessed a dragoon being pulled from his horse and piked to death, the sight of which prompted him to call off the rising to avoid further bloodshed. However he had lost all control of his followers and in one incident, the Lord Chief Justice of Ireland, Lord Kilwarden (see lot 40), reviled as chief prosecutor of William Orr in 1797, but also the judge who granted habeas corpus to Wolfe Tone in 1798, was dragged from his carriage and hacked to death. Sporadic clashes continued into the night until finally quelled by the military at the estimated cost of twenty soldiers and fifty rebels dead. After being captured Emmet was put on trial and made no attempt to defend himself however he requested that his Proclamation of the Provisional Government be read out in open court as it reflected his beliefs, morals and aspirations. It expressed his views on the rebellion, and emphasised his humanitarian concerns about the treatment of prisoners and the conduct of the republican government. The proclamation however was one which the British authorities had no intention of giving any publicity to and Emmet’s request to have it read was rejected by the court. However Emmet did manage to integrate direct quotations and paraphrased parts of his proclamation into his famous speech from the dock. He detailed the actions of the past eight months, the attempt to wrest power from England ‘with their own hands’, the point that foreign assistance was not ‘the foundation of the present exertion’ and referred to Ireland taking its place among the nations of the earth. Emmet was found guilty of treason and was hung, drawn and quartered – one of the last convicts to suffer this barbaric execution - on 20 September 1803 in Thomas Street, Dublin. Due to the destruction and suppression of the proclamation it never fully received the status and acknowledgment as the hugely important historical document that it is. It provided inspiration for Pádraig Pearse in writing the 1916 Proclamation and summed up Emmet’s remarkable opinions, some of which could be described as too modern to be accepted or understood in 1803. Approximately 10,000 copies of the proclamation are reputed to have been secretly printed on Emmet’s orders on 23 July 1803, but the British authorities went to great efforts in order to ensure that its content was suppressed and they were nearly all destroyed. It is hard to believe that so many were printed clandestinely, and it is far more likely, as in the case of the 1916 Proclamation, that the numbers printed were in the hundreds. As far as we have been able to ascertain there are three examples in private hands, of which the present example is one. About 500 copies of the 1916 Proclamation were printed, of which some fifty survive, mainly in public collections. We can find no record of an example of the 1803 Proclamation in either the National Library of Ireland, The National Museum of Ireland or Trinity College Library. As the penalty for possession of the 1803 Proclamation was very harsh, and could even, in certain circumstances, lead to the gallows, there were few prepared to keep it, which has made it one of the rarest, if not the rarest important printed document of Irish revolutionary history. €30,000-€50,000 (£26,100-£43,500 approx.) & Also : 296 1921: An extremely rare low numbered Thompson Submachine Gun, No. 142, donated to the Cork Brigade, IRA in 1921 by an Irish American Sheriff Provenance: Purchased by Michael Sheehan, San Mateo, California, May 1921; Thence to Cork Brigade IRA; Thence by descent from a War of Independence IRA Volunteer to the present owner, Co. Cork Early 1921 model Thompson submachine gun, one of a small number imported and used by the IRA during the War of Independence. The receiver is marked “Model 1921” with the serial number “142”, Thompson markings and five line patent dates, along with inspector’s mark directly behind the ejection port. With the rare and desirable early style of finned barrel (to aid in cooling when fired in a fullautomatic mode), the adjustable Lyman tangent rear sight with sight protectors that graduates from 100 to 600 yards, walnut vertical foregrip and detachable walnut buttstock. The Thompson Gun began production with serial number 1; the first 40 were all prototypes, making number 41 the first gun to be sold. The serial number of this particular gun is 142, the one hundred and second Thompson Gun to be sold and is very rare with such a low three digit serial number. It is estimated that somewhere in the region of 15,000 sets of the 1921 model parts were produced, with the majority of those being used to produce the later M1928A1 model of the weapon making this complete 1921 model extremely scarce. Colt records show that this gun, numbered “142” along with serial number “143” were dispatched by the Colt Company to a Mr M. Sheehan of San Mateo, California. Sheehan was in fact Sheriff Michael Sheehan, a prominent sheriff based in the San Mateo district of San Francisco. Sheehan was born in Mountcollins, County Limerick on 2 February 1861, had emigrated to the United States with his brother in the 1880s and became Sheriff of San Mateo in 1916. He was a member of numerous Catholic organisations including the Knights of Columbus and lived for some time in Tilman Street which was only three blocks from the address the guns were delivered to, at 316 B Street, which was a US Post Office in 1921. The San Mateo sheriff’s office never ordered Thompson Guns during the 1920s so there is no possibility that the weapons were for official use. In many ways the new gun was considered to be ideal for guerrilla warfare with its rapid fire of high calibre bullets and a removable stock: it packed a powerful punch whilst also being easy to conceal. The IRA was destined to become one of the first customers for the new machine-gun, after Michael Collins was contacted by the financier Thomas Fortune Ryan. With a high price of $225 per gun the IRA placed an order for 653 weapons, becoming Colt’s only customers at this time. The guns were to be sent to Ireland in May 1921 through New York but US Customs impounded 495 of them leaving only 158 which were eventually smuggled to Ireland. The first three arrived in Dublin in May 1921 and were test fired a few days later by Tom Barry at a meeting attended by Michael Collins and Richard Mulcahy. The IRA were also the first in the world to use the machine-gun in combat, when a group led by Oscar Traynor, used one in an ambush against members of the Royal West Kent Regiment near Drumcondra, County Dublin. The Thompson or “Tommy Gun” later went onto achieve world fame when it was used by both law enforcement and criminal gangs during the era of prohibition in the United States making it one of the most iconic weapons ever produced. It is not clear exactly how the gun was brought into Ireland but it is known that Sheriff Sheehan did make trips during this period to Ireland returning to San Francisco from Queenstown (Cobh) Co. Cork via New York. We also know that his nephew was arrested and interned. He later was imprisoned in Limerick during the Civil War, after which he emigrated to the USA via Canada to join his uncle in San Mateo. He was a member of the Cork Brigade IRA during the War of Independence. €10,000-€15,000 (£8,700-£13,100 approx.)

That's a very interesting album. Thanks for posting those.

Timo that female picture is very interesting. Thanks for sharing that.

Just seeing this thread now, & that is a very interesting card. Here is a very small addition ot the thread. His father Alderman Peadar S Doyle was a friend of Vincent Byrne (Comdt. Vincent Byrne II Bn, Dublin Brigade, Old IRA - of Michael Collins' Squad) here are a couple of christmas cards from him to V.Byrne.

Those pictures do seem to seal it - cheers.

Thanks, i am on mobile now & cant see the pic but will check that pic tomorrow.

Hmm well 2 votes is the majority ! I am looking at it very closely and the DRL seems like it might match the top part with a gap between the tops of the DRL letters - but not sure about the bottom part of the medal as it appears not to have the lower part letters in place if you know what I mean. Also not sure about the 2 different colour metals in that light outside dark inside combo - but again this could be the fold in the tunic and the light. Thanks for checking and for those verdicts - much appreciated. When I get a macro lens I will post back with an improved picture. Cheers.

I am not sure - this one appears to be of 2 different coloured metals, though that could be a trick of the light. I think the 2 metal DRL one would be brigter inside (for the gold) and darker outside unless I am mistaken. It looks the approximate size and roughly oval shape of the DRL and it may fit the man in the picture but I am not convinced.

Hi - no unfortunately not this is already quite heavily cropped. I could increase the size but it would be software interpolated and just 'bigger blur' if you know what I mean. I am on the lookout for a decent macro lens but for now this is as good as I can get it. Here for reference is the original view :

I am wondering if anyone can help to identify this medal - worn by a polizei man in this picture taken in Latvia Sept 1943 The ribbon bar appears to contain a KVK with swords - along with possibly polizei service, then a wound badge in black and beneath that a medal I can not place. It has been suggested a German Colonial Medal but after looking I can not seem to find a match to it. The image url may be bigger :

That's very interesting, never seen one of those before.

I'd be interested to hear what others make of the provenance on some of these items. Such as Padraíg Pearse's belt buckle (Lot 164) ; 1916. Pádraig Pearse’s Irish Volunteer belt buckle – a unique and rare memento of the leader of the 1916 Rising Provenance: Emmet Humphreys, (1902-1977), Fianna Éireann (1909-1916), later Captain E Company, 3rd Battalion, Dublin Brigade, IRA until 1923; thence to the present owner’s father, a prominent Belfast republican. A unique memento of the leader of the 1916 Rising, with impeccable provenance of two well known republican families. The Humphreys family were one of the great republican families with associations with all the major events of the fight for Irish freedom in the early part of the 20th Century. Emmet and his brother Dick attended Pádraig Pearse’s school, St. Enda’s, and aged 7, Emmet was one of the first members of Fianna Éireann, the republican paramilitary scouting organisation at its foundation in 1909, and participated in the 1916 Rising. Along with the rest of his family, including the redoubtable Sighle, Emmet was very involved in the War of Independence and on the Anti-Treaty side in the Civil War, and was imprisoned during both conflicts. The family continued their support of republican causes right into the 1970s and through that association befriended the father of the present owner of this historic relic. €8,000-€10,000 (£7,000-£8,800 approx.) Price Realised: €7500 , or Willie Pearse's tunic button (168) ; 1916. Willie Pearse - a button from his tunic Provenance: Emmet Humphreys, (1902-1977), Fianna Éireann (1909-1916),later Captain E Company, 3rd Battalion, Dublin Brigade, IRA until 1923; thence to the present owner’s father, a prominent Belfast republican. A unique memento from Pádraig Pearse’s brother Willie. William Pearse followed his father into sculpture and studied at the Metropolitan School of Art in Dublin under Oliver Sheppard as well as in Paris, and in the Kensington School of Art. Some of his sculptures are to be found in Limerick Cathedral, the Cathedral of St. Eunan and St Columba, Letterkenny and several Dublin churches. He worked for a while in the family monumental stone masonry business but left to help his brother Patrick run St. Enda’s School He followed his brother into the Irish Volunteers and the Republican movement, took part in the Easter Rising in 1916, constantly staying by his brother’s side at the General Post Office. Following the surrender he was court-martialed and sentenced to death, which is now thought to be due to the court’s assumption of a much greater role for Willie than he had, and Willie did nothing to dissuade the military prosecution from their view of his importance. He was executed on 4 May 1916. €2,000-€3,000 (£1,800-£2,600 approx.) Price Realised: €1800 The prices for this auction are now uploaded http://www.whytes.com/i7.asp?Auction=20101113&Lot=1

Just back from the Whytes auction in Dublin. The Fenian flag went for €52,000. Lot 183 the Irish Independence era/'Civil War photograph collection was withdrawn from sale before it began but all the other Rising /Independence era items seemed to be selling very well. Lots 153/4/5 the RIC Revolver and indian made Lee enfield (both apparently Irish Volunteer captured items) went quite well - if I recall correctly 3 x the reserve.

For anyone interested in Irish militaria (particularly Independence Era items) there is a major auction tomorrow Saturday November 13th 2010 at Whytes: http://www.whytes.ie/ HISTORY, LITERATURE & COLLECTIBLES Saturday 13 November 2010 Click for: Searchable on-line catalogue or Printable PDF VIEWING: at our galleries, 10-12 November 10am-6pm and 13 November 9.30am-12 noon. To register for Live Bidding click here. For catalogue changes click here For information on live bidding click here TV3 News feature on History Auction Irish Independent story Irish Times story The catalogue is here in .PDF format and well worth checking out - the prices have nosedived compared to the dizzying heights of just a few years ago: http://www.whytes.com/AuctionPDFs/20101113.pdf Eirman it might be an idea to check out the current whytes prices & which items meet their reserve in this current market. PS There is also the North Star fair tomorrow in Dublin.

Excellent - thanks for that.

Tasso

Kriegskamerad Tasso

I think the seller may have heard you as it's now been reduced to €7,000.00

Here is another interesting set of 1916 medals on ebay with a starting bid of €8,000.00 to a man who apparently fought in Boland's mills. There is no mention of provenance with it other than 'name revealed to buyer' http://cgi.ebay.ie/w...em=130427604950