JapanX

Well my dear friend these are certainly darn good finds. Not to mention new cap insignia material for Mitya Medal? Do you mean order of arts and science?! Because medal is forth class and it should be round. But actually it doesn't matter because according to statute (and as we all know the statute makes everything crystal clear in no time) this dude have two unknown orders... No? You think it is 2nd and 3rd class (both on red ribbons!) of this order?! But according to the statute 2nd class and 3rd class of this order should be "the simple cross with six (!) arms divided into three rays" for 2nd class "all enameled" and for 3rd class "partly enameled and partly metal". The black-and-white picture of 2nd and 3rd class of this order in statute had 6 rays. Orders of this dude have 8 rays. I think this photo was artificially created by some amateur dealer... Who forget to replace the ribbons by the way... Since these orders couldn't be awarded before 1852 (I think we all will agree on that), then these are some (unknown to us) updates of original order of Arts&Science that was established in 1852. I will say even more - I believe there was a breast star for this order! There are no breast stars in statute of 1852. I hope we will see this star pretty soon Regards, Nick

"Die Traumdeutung" should be the handbook of every phalerist P.S. "Puritanic rigorism"...What the heck is that?! We don't use such compound words in phaleristics :lol:

Exactly! Badges! If the soldiers and most of the officers were excluded, then it was some sort of special badge/insignia (in the form and in the place of usual cockade). As for the general insignia of Persian army check this out: "...A uniform of some sort and firearm was all that was necessary to make a Persian soldier..." from Lt.Col. Henry Picot special report on organization of Persian army, 1900. Sound like a militia to me As for Cossack... They wore usual cassack uniform... Nothing special and fancy... Royal guards... Hmmm... More likely Foreign Legion But if this special badge/cockade indeed was special military badge/cockade, than why some military top-brass Persians got it and the others didn't? (we have photos of caps without this insignia). Because it was some sort of decoration? I have doubts about it... And I don't observe (on the photos) any clear pattern "two lions with grenade = top-brass military" Banner... Well, in the center we have national coat of arms and on the every (?) corner "two lions with "grenade"". Maybe they thought "one big sun in the center is enough"? From heraldic point of view Cheers, Nick P.S. Nice looking botton by the way

I missed the second part Sorry about that. Consequences of agitation?! Nothing definitive for the moment But I don't think that "two lions with suns rising above their backs" was an emblem of Persian army or military cockade (in the usual meaning of this term). If it really was, then why there are photos of military Persians without any cockades on their caps... From the same time period... Another strong argument against this idea - we don't observe cockades on caps of Persian Cossack officers (I am preparing a piece about them ) and Persian Cossack Brigade was the best unit of Persian Army... As for the true meaning of this two different cockades... No clear idea... But I'll look into it Regards, Nick

"Handwritten notes on the Chinese Medal Book" - that would be great Richard! Regards, Nick

Hi Jeff Peterson book was, is and will be the first book on the subject (nobody will take it away from James W. Peterson). As for the time testing ... I don't think that there was any real testing activity Mostly faith... Regards, Nick P.S. Special thanks for Peterson CV.

I wish mate But back then I should choose between extra rare Common Glory order and this beautiful 2nd class set... Sad story :lol:

Hi Veteran This thread certainly belongs to the "Rest of the World" section of the forum (since there are no "International Orders section"). Hopefully moderators will move this thread to appropriate section Cheers, Nick

Awful...Sure... but real rare!!! :lol:

No! The caption on that photo states that it is FLORENCE NIGHTINGALE MEDAL As for additional yellow strip on miniatures ribbons - all miniatures that I saw had it.

I think he found this information in Japanese archives. Here comes original spec drawing attached to the China Incident Commemorative Medal Order signed by the Emperor and Tojo on 25th Sept 1942 (I ask him about it and he kindly posted it). As for asking.. Nick is a member of GMIC... ;)

My experience with this "machanism" is completely opposite Let me put it this way - different "others" will come to defense different people :lol:

Well there are three variation of insignia on the caps 1) none (not that uncommon variant ) 2) standing lion with sword 3) two lions with suns rising above their backs If "two lions with suns rising above their backs" is really an exclusive emblem of Persian Army, then why these guys have "standing lion with sword" cockades (they are certanly not wondering professors ) Regards, Nick

And then again two lions with suns rising above their backs

And you will certanly recognize this one ;)

And this one

Well let`s look at this two guys caps Mirza Martiros Khan Davidkhanian

Super nice set! Looks like Arthus Bertrand work to me...

Original case of issue with Nationalist China coat of arms on the lid, plus miniature and lapel hole rosette.

Breast Star, 90 mm, silver gilt, French import hallmark (swan), brilliant cut rays, superimposed parts silver gilt, enameled, reverse with long vertical tapered pin, numbered 652.

Complete 2nd Class Set. Sash Badge, 73 mm, silver gilt, French import hallmark (notorious swan ), silver gilt, enameled, with suspension ring and original sash, numbered 652.

Sorry to hear this Rich. These systems have "buyer-oriented bias". No doubt about it. As for "SHAME" thread ... Very dangerous...Double-edged weapon...Dishonest/unexpert buyers could easily used it against honest sellers or dishonest sellers could used it against honest sellers (to ruin the reputation of the last ones). Regards, Nick

Where is voting?! Or we will use buttom "like this" And another thing - let`s hope this thread won`t upset Japanese medal enthusiasts who has been reiterated Peterson "collaborators" theory Cheers, Nick P.S. As for fakes - price is important factor, but the real driving force behind market for fakes - popularity of this or that piece. I don`t think that this piece that popular (I mean "iron cross" popular).

But then again even modern regulation (adopted in 1991) for this medals states the colors of the ribbon the same way: “The Medal shall be attached by a red and white ribbon to a laurel crown surrounding a red cross” (Article 4). Very strange! On every modern piece we see three color ribbon (white-red-yellow)…

Another strange thing – this sentence in the first article.