New photos and many questions

[Robert Noss]

I got some new photos, this time they are not from a fleamarket but out of the trash-box.

Somebody has thrown them away at our local recycling-storage facility.

Start with these:

1.) + 2.)

What are these ?

Details of uniforms and shoulder-boards

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A puzzle for me.

[Robert Noss]

.....

There is a "L" and a "2" on the shoulder-boards. On one photo they wear Tschakos. Are they police ?

Many are wearing different collar-tabs.

On the back is a very faded writing. I can read "Reinickendorf" which is a suburb of Berlin. A date could be 1.8.16 but not very sure.

3.) , 4.) , 5.)

Three photos. Soldiers on a ship and in front of a building.

One is dated 23.12.19 and in Hamburg ( on the ship)

Details:

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[Robert Noss]

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more details

Some heraldic sign on the waggon

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[Robert Noss]

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the third photo of this series

All these soldiers are wearing armbands on their lower sleeves.

Because of the date - do You think they are Freikorps soldiers ?

Or some kind of Einwohnerwehr ? Militia ?

Any reason for the ship ? Is there a historical event in 1919 when Freikorps soldiers where shipped to anywhere ?

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[Robert Noss]

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6.) Last one for today

What is the meaning of the roman AND arabic numbers on the collar ?

Thanks as always in advance for any comments.

Hope You like the photos. I found them quite interesting.

And there are many more.

Kind regards

Robert

Edited August 17, 2006 by Robert Noss

[Paul R]

I cannot offer any answers to the questions you have asked, yet I want to thank you for posting these very detailed photos! They are some of the best ww1 photos I have seen.

[Guest Rick Research]

Posts 1 & 2: the shakos are Garde Sch?tzen Bataillon. "L 2" = Luftschiffer Bataillon 2.

The soldiers on the ship have no shoulder straps, and the same strange cuff titles as below. I think they must be Provisonal Reichsheer on some sort of landing exercise OR perhaps are returning soldiers from the Baltic... some sort of Freikorps.

Post #4-- I don't know what the cuff title is, but these are soldiers of the Provisonal Reichsheer of 1919-- some are wearing the "haricots verts" "green bean" shoulder cords, and the sleeve chevrons on several = the old army rank title "Sergeant" which would become "Unterfeldwebel."

Post #5-- "49 VII" is Landsturm Battalion 49 of the VII. Armeekorps.

[Chip]

Robert,

Trying to deciper these photos can be a real brain teaser, but always enjoyable. Thanks for posting them. The first two photos are of some very young Luftschiff recruits. Both show them with their instructor. The first photo shows at least three different uniform patterns. The second photo of this group displays their Tschakos with the Garde star on the front.

I am wondering why all of the men in the last photo with the instuments do not have the unit numbers on their collars? They all have the Landsturm Gurtband shoulder straps. It is interesting that the only one with the numbers is also the only one wearing a M10/15 tunic. All of the others (with the exception of the one with the Drillich jacket and apron) are wearing the Bluse.

Chip

[Glenn J]

Robert,

VII. 49 was the Landsturm-Infanterie-Batallion Elberfeld mobilisied on the 10th of September 1914. It later became I./Landsturm Infanterie-Regiment Nr. 48 in June 1918.

Regards

Glenn

[Robert Noss]

Thanks a lot for the explanations.

So - am I right that "Luftschiffer" soldiers had a Tschako ?

I didn't know that before. I always thought Tschakos were for police and J?ger.

I already presumed Luftschiffer cause of the L on their boards, but thought in this case it could mean Landespolizei.

Between that lot of photos was also a soldbuch of a Luftschiffer recruit.

Kind regards

Robert

[Chip]

Robert,

Did your Luftschiffer have much of a wartime service record? It would be interesting to know what field units he served with.

I don't think that the police started wearing the Tschako until Weimar times. During the imperial period, most state police forces wore a version of the Pickelhaube.

Many pre-1918 military units wore the Tschakko. Among them were the J?gers, Garde Sch?tzen, Luftschiffer, Landsturm infantry, W?rttemburg Mountain Regiment, the Maschinengewehr Abteilungen, See Bataillonen and so on.

Chip

[Guest Rick Research]

I didn't know Luftschiffer had the "Sch?tzen" type star-- thought they had J?ger eagles.

[Chip]

Rick,

You are partially correct. While the 1st and 2nd battalions wore the Garde star, the rest of the battalions wore the the line eagle.

Chip

[Robert Noss]

Robert,

Did your Luftschiffer have much of a wartime service record? It would be interesting to know what field units he served with.

I don't think that the police started wearing the Tschako until Weimar times. During the imperial period, most state police forces wore a version of the Pickelhaube.

Many pre-1918 military units wore the Tschakko. Among them were the J?gers, Garde Sch?tzen, Luftschiffer, Landsturm infantry, W?rttemburg Mountain Regiment, the Maschinengewehr Abteilungen, See Bataillonen and so on.

Chip

Hello Chip,

unfortunately not. He was enlisted 23.5.1918 and did see no action. He was de-mobilized in 1919.

There is a passport photo of this man, certainly from after 1945. It has the stamp of "The king's royal hussars" - Intelligence Section.

Does anybody know what that could mean ?

Was he working for the british forces after 1945 or is it just for a "white-wash" document ?

Kind regards

Robert